Manximus Aururaneus Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: @Manximus Aururaneus The UK Government could have imposed rules and conditions but chose not to do so. They then blamed the whole thing on the EU, which is what Johnson built his whole career on. I don't disagree with that (but then immigration was never one of my main reasons for wanting to leave the EU). But I go back to the point - If is ok for EU, Spain ( and could have been a UK Government choice within the EU as you say) to exercise immigration control as an EU member - Then why does it suddenly become Nationalist, Racist, Populist etc. to do the very same outside the guises of the EU? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted January 21, 2020 Share Posted January 21, 2020 3 hours ago, manxman1980 said: Where did I put my irony metre?? What a wonderfully profound concept. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Manximus Aururaneus said: I don't disagree with that (but then immigration was never one of my main reasons for wanting to leave the EU). But I go back to the point - If is ok for EU, Spain ( and could have been a UK Government choice within the EU as you say) to exercise immigration control as an EU member - Then why does it suddenly become Nationalist, Racist, Populist etc. to do the very same outside the guises of the EU? It doesn’t, and how fortunate immigration was never one of your main reasons for wanting to leave the EU. Considering the terrible cost to the economy so far and the slow realisation that the U.K. is now so much weaker and no longer has a voice at the high table where it used to be so influential, what was it you thought was going to be better? Wasn’t it all just to save the financial elite from paying tax? Or are you a sociopathic hater of Britain like Rog? Edited January 22, 2020 by Freggyragh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manximus Aururaneus Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 7 hours ago, Freggyragh said: It doesn’t, and how fortunate immigration was never one of your main reasons for wanting to leave the EU. Considering the terrible cost to the economy so far and the slow realisation that the U.K. is now so much weaker and no longer has a voice at the high table where it used to be so influential, what was it you thought was going to be better? Wasn’t it all just to save the financial elite from paying tax? Or are you a sociopathic hater of Britain like Rog? Do you have even the slightest shred of evidence to support that claim? Most sociopathic haters of Britain do not volunteer for 22 years military service in defence of it it would suggest. (Cue; You can't mention military service on MF!! ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Manximus Aururaneus said: Most sociopathic haters of Britain do not volunteer for 22 years military service in defence of it it would suggest. If you had done it for free even though you hated it then that would definitely count as voluntary service. In Britain it's typically a professional career move. Quite rightly. Edited January 22, 2020 by pongo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 11 hours ago, mojomonkey said: I don't think it should be lowered to 16 either, 18 seems the right age to me. Sorry, I am very tolerant but many of Rog's views are abhorrent, I'm pretty sure he says a lot of them purely for effect though. Wrong. AndI am FAR from alone in holding opinions and values that some people find reactionary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 10 hours ago, manxman1980 said: @Manximus Aururaneus The UK Government could have imposed rules and conditions but chose not to do so. They then blamed the whole thing on the EU, which is what Johnson built his whole career on. The reality is that we could not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 8 hours ago, Freggyragh said: It doesn’t, and how fortunate immigration was never one of your main reasons for wanting to leave the EU. Considering the terrible cost to the economy so far and the slow realisation that the U.K. is now so much weaker and no longer has a voice at the high table where it used to be so influential, what was it you thought was going to be better? Wasn’t it all just to save the financial elite from paying tax? Or are you a sociopathic hater of Britain like Rog? A sociopathic hater of Britain? That's almost funny. Admittedly I disliked what Britain, especially England, had become after so many years of Socialist and Socialist influenced government and the destructive effect on Britain by the loathsome thing that the trading bloc we had joined had morphed into but sociopathic hater of Britain? Only in your mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 Quote The reality is that we could not. Prove it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 Quote Why is it democratically legitimate for somebody to argue that the voting age should be reduced from 18 to 16, but then claim that somebody is wrong to argue that it should be raised from 18 to 30 (whatever)? In a democracy, both points of view should be valid arguments to be put forward for debate without the proposer being shot down for having the view, no? Just wondered why anyone would give complete equivalence to one proposition that increases freedom to another proposition that restricts it? I mean...who in their right mind would actually vote to reduce their rights and freedoms? Oh, hang on a mo...... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 1 hour ago, Rog said: Wrong. AndI am FAR from alone in holding opinions and values that some people find reactionary. Difference is, those people probably know to keep their hateful opinions to themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 Adapted: I do not agree with many of Rog's view's - but I defend to the hilt his right to express them without undue and overpowering shouting down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 Quote ut I go back to the point - If is ok for EU, Spain ( and could have been a UK Government choice within the EU as you say) to exercise immigration control as an EU member - Then why does it suddenly become Nationalist, Racist, Populist etc. to do the very same outside the guises of the EU? Because one is built on discussed and approved common regulation and the other is based on arbitrary concepts whilst totally ignoring (or worse, blaming) the aforementioned approved common regulation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 5 minutes ago, ballaughbiker said: Adapted: I do not agree with many of Rog's view's - but I defend to the hilt his right to express them without undue and overpowering shouting down. Freedom of speech is not freedom from consequences. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted January 22, 2020 Share Posted January 22, 2020 9 minutes ago, RIchard Britten said: Difference is, those people probably know to keep their hateful opinions to themselves. Yes, Richard, and look at the bloody mess that has resulted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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