RIchard Britten Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 1 minute ago, manxman1980 said: I still cannot understand those who were in favour of Brexit objecting to allowing Scotland to have a referendum on independence though. I thought you were all about sovereignty, control of borders etc etc. Why deny that chance to Scotland? What is good for the goose, should be good for the gander... But Westminster does not want to lose things like territorial waters, nuc sub bases, etc. ScotIndyRef will never happen. Not because they don't want it, but because Westminster will never allow it. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 3 minutes ago, RIchard Britten said: What is good for the goose, should be good for the gander... But Westminster does not want to lose things like territorial waters, nuc sub bases, etc. ScotIndyRef will never happen. Not because they don't want it, but because Westminster will never allow it. And nor should we. That toad Blair has a lot to answer for, most of it in court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 18 minutes ago, Rog said: And nor should we. That toad Blair has a lot to answer for, most of it in court. I would have loved to have seen your reaction if the EU had said, and had the legal power, to say that the UK could not have a referendum on leaving... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 Just now, manxman1980 said: I would have loved to have seen your reaction if the EU had said, and had the legal power, to say that the UK could not have a referendum on leaving... It's a totally different situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 Scotland should be allowed its referendum. Once public opinion for independence reaches 60% it would be the most logical option. Let them vote on it, I can't see why not. Under those circumstances Boris surely would have to give it further consideration other than the brusque denials he's trotted-out to date. It would be undemocratic to ignore a populist vote. Outside of Scotland, it's rare to find any media which is giving voice to those who don't want independence. On the face of it you'd be forgiven to believe it's all Jocks who seek it, but this is not the case. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 12 minutes ago, Rog said: It's a totally different situation. How? Because of the Treaty of Union? A political union? Scotland also has it's own laws, Church, education and parliament. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 4 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: How? Because of the Treaty of Union? A political union? Scotland also has it's own laws, Church, education and parliament. Yes, the treaty of union. Thankfully our relationship with the UK never reached that far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 46 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: Tell your mate Boris Johnson to give them a referendum and let them choose. I still cannot understand those who were in favour of Brexit objecting to allowing Scotland to have a referendum on independence though. I thought you were all about sovereignty, control of borders etc etc. Why deny that chance to Scotland? Er......... I think you are getting confused. 5 hours ago, woolley said: I would give them the referendum after the 2021 Scottish election. Although as Rog says, it is quite a different matter. I happen to believe they know which side their bread is buttered and would not vote for it, but I would certainly give them the referendum. Perhaps there should be a UK wide referendum on Scottish independence. That would be interesting. And on a point of order: Boris is not my mate, although he did, finally, get Brexit done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 (edited) 30 minutes ago, quilp said: Scotland should be allowed its referendum. Once public opinion for independence reaches 60% it would be the most logical option. Let them vote on it, I can't see why not. Under those circumstances Boris surely would have to give it further consideration other than the brusque denials he's trotted-out to date. It would be undemocratic to ignore a populist vote. Outside of Scotland, it's rare to find any media which is giving voice to those who don't want independence. On the face of it you'd be forgiven to believe it's all Jocks who seek it, but this is not the case. As I said earlier, more Scots voted for Brexit than voted for the SNP. I think Boris probably will accede to the request at some point. In the meantime I think they are playing to the Unionist lobby in Scotland as the only party protecting their position in the UK, while at the same time giving the SNP government rope and enough time to hang themselves with domestic policy failures. Edited February 6, 2020 by woolley 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 46 minutes ago, Rog said: Yes, the treaty of union. Thankfully our relationship with the UK never reached that far. Right.... Haven't you been complaining that the EU was becoming a political union rather than a trading bloc? 46 minutes ago, woolley said: Er......... I think you are getting confused. Not specifically you in this case but certainly Rog and a few others on here. 46 minutes ago, woolley said: Although as Rog says, it is quite a different matter. I happen to believe they know which side their bread is buttered and would not vote for it, but I would certainly give them the referendum. Perhaps there should be a UK wide referendum on Scottish independence. That would be interesting. Most people thought that the UK would vote to remain in the UK and look what happened... 46 minutes ago, woolley said: And on a point of order: Boris is not my mate, although he did, finally, get Brexit done. I had you down as a card carrying Conservative member. Oh well... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 7 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: I had you down as a card carrying Conservative member. Oh well... Certainly not. I don't believe in globalisation and the world ruled by unregulated capitalist forces. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 10 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: Not specifically you in this case but certainly Rog and a few others on here. OK. It was just my post you were replying to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rog Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 17 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: Right.... Haven't you been complaining that the EU was becoming a political union rather than a trading bloc? . Yes, it was becoming a political union but it had not reached the point that it had become a state in its own right but was perilously close to being one. The UK is a state in its own right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
display name Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 8 hours ago, manxman1980 said: Nope... we are not part of the United Kingdom. The IOM just does as England says. If they dared otherwise,it'd be back to spud munching,thieving and inbreeding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted February 6, 2020 Share Posted February 6, 2020 1 hour ago, Rog said: Yes, the treaty of union. Thankfully our relationship with the UK never reached that far. There is historical precedent though when Ireland achieved home rule having previously been part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland following Act of Union 1800. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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