pongo Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 (edited) David Davis says the UK will stay 'aligned' to EU trade rules after Brexit Quote LONDON — The Brexit secretary has said that the government is aiming for the UK to still have "alignment" with the European Union after Brexit. Speaking in the House of Commons, David Davis told MPs: "Alignment isn't harmonisation, it isn't having exactly the same rules, it's sometimes having mutually recognised rules, mutually recognised inspections, that sort of thing. That's what we are aiming for." The Brexit secretary said: "Any regulatory alignment we get as part of Brexit deal for Northern Ireland will apply for the whole country." This is similar to what Scottish Conservative leader Ruth Davidson called for on Tuesday morning, saying the whole of the UK to have regulatory alignment with the EU if that is what is needed to continue a "frictionless" Irish border. ... when Davis was asked by the pro-Brexit Conservative MP Jacob Rees-Mogg to set a red line that there would be regulatory "divergence" between the UK and EU, the Brexit secretary said: "The red line for me is delivering the best Brexit deal." ^ presumably the shape of the deal to be announced this week If so then that will be more hard Brexit red lines wooshing past. And an end to their dreams of walking away. Edited December 5, 2017 by pongo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 make your mind up on dd pongo.... clearly pongo hasn't seen the withdrawal legislation which set all this out months ago..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 32 minutes ago, woody2 said: clearly pongo hasn't seen the withdrawal legislation which set all this out months ago..... Perhaps you are talking about the, so called, Great Repeal Bill which deals with writing existing legislation and regulation into UK law. This is is not that. Here they are specifically talking about on-going and future regulation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 its not called that anymore and it covers the future which is why a trade deal should be straight forward....... i wonder why the eu sent a un-agreed document to the dup..... seeing your reaction, it clearly worked..... you also missed the big deal that was done yesterday..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, woody2 said: its not called that anymore and it covers the future which is why a trade deal should be straight forward....... i wonder why the eu sent a un-agreed document to the dup..... seeing your reaction, it clearly worked..... you also missed the big deal that was done yesterday..... I thought you didn’t want a trade deal. I am fairly sure that yesterday was part of the dance and that the DUP were supposed to get all uppity. Two roads leading in the same direction and all that. It’s good of them to play their part so well, right? Please do link to yesterday’s “big deal”. It’s all about the sharing. BTW - everyone does still call it the “Great Repeal Bill”, followed by a slightly embarrassed laugh and the apologetic (it wasn’t my idea) face. Le Grand maybe works better, given that it often implies Irony. Edited December 5, 2017 by pongo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 the bill was never called that..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojomonkey Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 Pongo said people call it that (and they do), he isn't claiming it's the official title. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_(Withdrawal)_Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 link to yesterday’s “big deal” Woody? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 13 minutes ago, mojomonkey said: Pongo said people call it that (and they do), he isn't claiming it's the official title. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union_(Withdrawal)_Bill "everyone" he said..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 10 minutes ago, pongo said: link to yesterday’s “big deal” Woody? you missed it? shame...... no doubt it will be your next drama "breaking news" in 12 months Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 (edited) If it’s such an important deal then I am surprised you don’t want to share the news. Edited December 5, 2017 by pongo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarne Posted December 5, 2017 Share Posted December 5, 2017 https://news.sky.com/story/terror-plot-to-assassinate-pm-may-foiled-11158388 Muslims attempt to kill May. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted December 6, 2017 Share Posted December 6, 2017 On 04/12/2017 at 8:25 PM, pongo said: I feel sorry for Mrs May. Nobody is going to be pleased with her whatever she does. It must take a lot of stamina. And imagine having to deal with the hard Brexiteers on one side and the DUP on the other. Goons like Redwood, Farage and Mogg. And she quite rightly never even supported Brexit in the first place. Very few on the inside of British industry do, only a few mavericks and spivs. I don't feel sorry for her at all. Her ridiculously glib and stupidly shallow "strong and stable" campaign in a mis-judged and unnecessary election resulted in her having to bribe the DUP with £1 fucking billion of taxpayers money to stay in power. Having taken the money they are now forcing the whole shambolic mess that is the negotiations to dance to their tune. Have you any idea how stupid the UK looks on the international stage? And who is fighting the UK's corner on that international stage? Boris fucking Johnson, that's who. You know, the one who is pretty much universally reviled by all those who have to deal with him. What a total horlicks.... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted December 6, 2017 Share Posted December 6, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, P.K. said: I don't feel sorry for her at all. Her ridiculously glib and stupidly shallow "strong and stable" campaign etc Yes there have certainly been lots of mistakes. But I still feel empathy for her at this point. Imagine the stress of it all. Nobody is going to be happy with any outcome. That's not to diminish the mess of it all. It's probably the worst job in Britain right now. It's starting to look rather like negotiating the Good Friday Agreement - finding the right words to bring as many people along as possible. But nobody is going to get all of what they want - and nobody serious should be expecting that since it would be a divisive outcome. People must be beginning to be able to see now that it is all much more nuanced than a binary in or out. Because it involves layers of agreement and regulation over many decades which are much more intricately threaded and woven in. And any outcome needs to bring everyone along. Or else the divisions become permanent. And because British people do not share a common sense of what being British and European even means (for example - everyone living on the island of Ireland continues to be an EU citizen because the GFA guarantees their dual nationality - and many more in Britain value their existing EU citizenship ). Edited December 6, 2017 by pongo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 6, 2017 Share Posted December 6, 2017 pongo and pk don't have a clue what is going on..... Quote David Trimble: The Irish government is dragging Brexit into dangerous territory The Taoiseach should stop trying to out-Sinn-Fein Sinn Fein When I negotiated the Good Friday Agreement nearly 20 years ago, no one foresaw a day when the -United Kingdom would be leaving the European Union. It was impossible to imagine how the issue of the border between Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic, from which the barriers were removed as part of the agreement, would again become an issue of such political importance. We have the Taoiseach, Leo Varadkar, threatening to veto the Brexit negotiations unless Theresa May gives a formal written guarantee that there will be no hard -border, and we keep hearing the argument that a departure of the UK from the single market and the customs union would put at risk the peace process and Good Friday Agreement. In other words, if the -border gates go back up again we will be back into the Troubles. This cannot go unchallenged. The reason the issue of the border has been brought up in the way it has is not because of any practical reasons but because of the internal -politics of the Irish Republic. The Taoiseach has been in desperate negotiations with other party leaders in order to prevent a general -election being triggered. He is -snarling at London, trying to make a big issue about the border, because he is worried Sinn Fein might benefit if he does not. It is not true that Brexit in any way threatens the peace process. There is -nothing in the Good Friday Agreement which even touches on the normal conduct of business between Northern Ireland and the Republic. Leaving the EU does not affect the agreement because the EU had nothing to do with it — except that Michel Barnier turned up at the last moment for a photo opportunity. The EU does have a peace and reconciliation programme for Northern Ireland but there is no provision for it in the EU budget. It is financed from loose change in the drawer of the European Commission. What would threaten the peace process, on the other hand, is Dublin’s suggestion that the border question could be solved by the UK having an internal -border running down the Irish Sea, with mainland Britain leaving the single market and the customs union and Northern -Ireland remaining within them. The Belfast Agreement recognises British sovereignty in Northern Ireland, and recognises Northern Ireland as part of the UK. To have provisions treating us as if we are not part of the UK is clearly contrary to that agreement and is something no unionist is going to support. Once it begins to dawn on the unionist electorate that the Irish government is trying to break up the UK then we are into very dangerous territory indeed. The government needs to quash this idea very quickly, and make it clear that we will not have any damage done to our constitution. I do not want to go back to the days of fences and barriers any more than does anyone else. But then neither does Theresa May. The government has repeatedly made it clear that it has no intention of putting up border posts on its side of the border. But it can’t give assurances that the EU won’t insist on border checks on the southern side. That will be an external EU border, and it will be the EU’s decision. There is no reason from our point of view why the border cannot remain open. We already have to deal with the issue of -smuggling because, in spite of the single market, there remain differences in -regulations and duties. When I was first minister there was a big problem with smuggling diesel. I brought this up with Tony Blair, but I -suspect it was allowed to go on partly because former leading members of the IRA were deeply involved in it. Then there is the issue of migration. A couple of years ago the Irish police stopped a vehicle that had come over the -border from Northern Ireland into the Republic carrying half a dozen people who were -travelling to work, but had no right to work there. They sent them straight back again. The border has never gone away entirely. There is no reason it can’t continue to be policed without hard barriers, even after Brexit. It is illogical for the EU to demand an agreement on the border before it will even discuss a trade agreement. We don’t know what the terms of the trade agreement will be, so how could anyone know what kind of a border would be needed? We might end up with an agreement where we don’t have tariffs — in which case the whole issue would ease considerably. The real reason why the border has become such an issue is that Sinn Fein is -trying to exploit Brexit to break up the UK. And the whole reason Sinn Fein collapsed in Northern Ireland’s -assembly is because its leaders realised that if they were serving in British institutions — and the Northern Ireland Assembly is a British institution — it would be much -harder for them to do this. What Leo Varadkar is doing is trying to appeal to Sinn Fein voters. He hasn’t learned the lesson that some Irish nationals have painfully learned in Northern Ireland: that you can’t out-Sinn Fein Sinn Fein. All he is doing is validating its position. For its own reasons, the EU is egging him on. It just shows you how desperate the EU and Irish nationalists are that they’re -clutching at these straws. https://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/12/david-trimble-the-irish-government-is-dragging-brexit-into-dangerous-territory/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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