Manximus Aururaneus Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 1 minute ago, pongo said: But citizenship does not always afford voting rights. Voting rights are attached to residency. Many British citizens living outside of the UK have no way of exercising their democratic voting rights as British citizens. So you are not a member of the EU, not a resident of the EU, not a financial contributor or recipient of the EU, not subject to EU laws or regulation, not entitled to vote in the EU, not entitled to EU legal representation, and cannot even provide a definition of what 'EU Citizenship' actually is - but you don't want to 'give all that up'? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manximus Aururaneus Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Anyway Gentlemen, family duty calls, thanks for the banter, Merry Xmas to you all. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesultanofsheight Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Manximus Aururaneus said: Of course leaving the EU will mean that - Leaving the EU is what was voted for. It will also restrict the rights of citizens of other EU countries to live and work in the UK - Again what was voted for. Age is irrelevant (as you well know). The Blue passport is a consequence not a causation (as again you well know). The FEANI register is a good example of demonstrating why you are (still) scaremongering - The EU has 28 (soon to be 27) of the 195 countries in the world as member states - The European FEANI register does not have 27 or 28 members - it has 34. It’s pointless even trying to enter into rational debates with you. Funny a focused new poster drags up exactly the same tired old arguments as longer term posters on here have been dragging up for years Ad Infinitum. My point was that whether the majority (a hideously thin majority) voted for it or not the end result is going to be screwing younger people’s ability to work elsewhere and restricting people’s rights to travel. That is not a good outcome. Not for anyone. Therefore as Pongo said the reality of that really needs to go to a second referendum now it’s clear that is going to be the exact outcome. Edited December 24, 2017 by thesultanofsheight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manximus Aururaneus Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 (edited) 9 minutes ago, thesultanofsheight said: It’s pointless even trying to enter into rational debates with you. Funny a focused new poster drags up exactly the same tired old arguments as longer term posters on here have been dragging up for years Ad Infinitum. My point was that whether the majority (a hideously thin majority) voted for it or not the end result is going to be screwing younger people’s ability to work elsewhere and restricting people’s rights to travel. That is not a good outcome. Not for anyone. Therefore as Pongo said the reality of that really needs to go to a second referendum now it’s clear that is going to be the exact outcome. You are not forced to debate with me - it's your choice. I travelled all over Europe (and the rest of the world) way before we joined the EU - surely you did too considering your definition of our (well travelled) Foreign Secretary as 'Isolationist' Gotta go. Merry Xmas. Edited December 24, 2017 by Manximus Aururaneus 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 So you are not a member of the EU, not a resident of the EU, not a financial contributor or recipient of the EU, not subject to EU laws or regulation, not entitled to vote in the EU, not entitled to EU legal representation, and cannot even provide a definition of what 'EU Citizenship' actually is - but you don't want to 'give all that up'? It’s not a question of not being able to define citizenship - it’s that you are better looking it up at source. And it’s not about me. It’s not about my citizenship or residency (which you presume to know anything about). Your basic complaint is that it was undemocratic you not being asked whether you wanted to become an EU citizen. It is clearly equally undemocratic that many British people living outside of the UK were not given the chance to vote on having that citizenship removed. Their residency, tax status, domicile etc is utterly irrelevant in this context. Assuming that citizenship is the issue you seem to want it to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paswt Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 24 minutes ago, pongo said: It’s not a question of not being able to define citizenship - it’s that you are better looking it up at source. And it’s not about me. It’s not about my citizenship or residency (which you presume to know anything about). Your basic complaint is that it was undemocratic you not being asked whether you wanted to become an EU citizen. It is clearly equally undemocratic that many British people living outside of the UK were not given the chance to vote on having that citizenship removed. Their residency, tax status, domicile etc is utterly irrelevant in this context. Assuming that citizenship is the issue you seem to want it to be. I had a chance to vote but took the view that as I no longer lived in England and had made the decision that the IOM was my home then it was inappropriate to cast my vote. That said it may be that "ex pats" living in Europe may have voted to stay in the EU because they perceived it to be to their personal advantage. Just saying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the stinking enigma Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 It's all about making Britain great again. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 1 hour ago, the stinking enigma said: It's all about making Britain great again. ho ho ho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 1 hour ago, paswt said: I had a chance to vote but took the view that as I no longer lived in England and had made the decision that the IOM was my home then it was inappropriate to cast my vote. Manximus Aururaneus's grumble related to citizenship and not residency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 (edited) 3 hours ago, thesultanofsheight said: It’s pointless even trying to enter into rational debates with you. Funny a focused new poster drags up exactly the same tired old arguments as longer term posters on here have been dragging up for years Ad Infinitum. My point was that whether the majority (a hideously thin majority) voted for it or not the end result is going to be screwing younger people’s ability to work elsewhere and restricting people’s rights to travel. That is not a good outcome. Not for anyone. Therefore as Pongo said the reality of that really needs to go to a second referendum now it’s clear that is going to be the exact outcome. no it won't...... #fakenews Edited December 24, 2017 by woody2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 3 minutes ago, woody2 said: no it won't...... #fakenews Yes it will. #woody2muppet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 1 minute ago, GD4ELI said: Yes it will. #woody2muppet no it won't, eu have already announced what a 5 year visa will cost, they are also working on personal membership..... its a non issue, just something for the remoans to spread fakenews about..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 14 minutes ago, woody2 said: no it won't, eu have already announced what a 5 year visa will cost, they are also working on personal membership..... its a non issue, just something for the remoans to spread fakenews about..... The word is VISA. UK citizens will be behind all EU citizens when it comes to jobs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 1 hour ago, GD4ELI said: The word is VISA. UK citizens will be behind all EU citizens when it comes to jobs. just as they are now...... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 11 minutes ago, woody2 said: just as they are now...... If you have been finding that in practice then in reality it means they don’t rate working with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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