Freggyragh Posted June 14, 2018 Share Posted June 14, 2018 (edited) What should have happened was a parliamentary debate about what was wanted out of Brexit before the negotiations started. Serious debate of the issues was impossible because of the cherry picking ‘they need us more than we need them’ and ‘we can have our cake and eat it’ nonsense. You can’t make plans with a serious analysis of each area up for discussion when half the team believe in unicorns. Edited June 14, 2018 by Freggyragh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 The "divorce bill" said it all. After months and months of obfuscation they, errrrr, paid it. Clowns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) Quote t is perfectly valid to lay the blame for the difficulties of the government in the Brexit negotiations at the door of the Remain backslider rebels because they are the ones making the UK's position with Barnier impossible. They want to send Davis in there under the cloud that if they don't like the deal they will be able to vote it down in the "meaningful vote" with the implied threat that they can bring down the government and then the whole issue is once more in play and the referendum result can be overturned. In such circumstances what incentive is there for the other side to agree an acceptable deal? Far better from their point of view to watch the British fight among themselves with the possible prize of them crawling back into the EU fold with increased budget contributions. At a time when national unity is required the disgraceful treachery of Soubry, Grieve et al should not be forgotten or forgiven. For that to be valid, a deal that suits all to some degree would have to be possible. I very much doubt that is the case. That is a different, but not entirely unrelated, issue to May and Davis being useless although I am starting to feel sorry for May. She has been handed a near on impossible task. Edited June 15, 2018 by ballaughbiker to some degree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 6 hours ago, P.K. said: The "divorce bill" said it all. After months and months of obfuscation they, errrrr, paid it. Clowns. But, but, but they all said we wouldn't.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 On 6/14/2018 at 9:17 AM, pongo said: He may well struggle to find good employees as he tries to grow his business. Everyone employable already has a job. Ports backed up. Flights grounded. No mechanisms or procedures or systems in place for continued trade. Supply of medicines is an issue frequently discussed. There needs to be a plan and that planning needs to start 5 years ago. The last time this was mentioned some here drew dismissive comparisons with the 'Millennium Bug'. A huge amount of work (and money) went in to fixing the very real issues. Oh dear. I wondered when he would wheel out "Project Fear" again. I think I should start watching "Love Island". There was a clip of it on the news programme this morning. A group of bikini clad young women, your typical switched on "Remain" supporters, were sitting around and the conversation went something like this: "What do you think of Brexit?" "What's that?" "Well we're leaving the European Union, innit" Blank looks. "So we won't be able to get cheese anymore?" "Cheese?" "Don't know." "We won't be able to go on holiday." "Oh no. I love my holidays." Pongo's flights, trade and medicines scares are something along the same lines and about as intelligent. His analogy with the millennium bug is apposite. This too was a massive scare story promulgated by vested interests and a huge amount of money did indeed go into fixing not so real issues. Then they were telling us that planes would fall out of the sky. Now Pongo is telling us they won't even take off. Wasn't going to happen then; isn't going to happen now. https://thenextweb.com/us/2017/06/16/us-government-will-stop-battling-the-y2k-bug-at-last/ 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 11 minutes ago, woolley said: A group of bikini clad young women, your typical switched on "Remain" supporters So....are we gonna discuss this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinkle Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 3 hours ago, RIchard Britten said: So....are we gonna discuss this? No, why not discuss this; http://commentcentral.co.uk/eu-immigration-we-need-solutions-not-problems/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 43 minutes ago, twinkle said: No, why not discuss this; http://commentcentral.co.uk/eu-immigration-we-need-solutions-not-problems/ Sure... What do you want to discuss about it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 Is this the UK Brexiteers wanted? https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/man-vanish-muslim-woman-stain-remover-bleach-supermarket-islamophobia-a8399606.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Phat Tog Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 4 hours ago, woolley said: Oh dear. I wondered when he would wheel out "Project Fear" again. I think I should start watching "Love Island". There was a clip of it on the news programme this morning. A group of bikini clad young women, your typical switched on "Remain" supporters, were sitting around and the conversation went something like this: "What do you think of Brexit?" "What's that?" "Well we're leaving the European Union, innit" Blank looks. "So we won't be able to get cheese anymore?" "Cheese?" "Don't know." "We won't be able to go on holiday." "Oh no. I love my holidays." Pongo's flights, trade and medicines scares are something along the same lines and about as intelligent. His analogy with the millennium bug is apposite. This too was a massive scare story promulgated by vested interests and a huge amount of money did indeed go into fixing not so real issues. Then they were telling us that planes would fall out of the sky. Now Pongo is telling us they won't even take off. Wasn't going to happen then; isn't going to happen now. https://thenextweb.com/us/2017/06/16/us-government-will-stop-battling-the-y2k-bug-at-last/ You know what's really worrying about that brief but dull-witted exchange? The girl who didn't know what Brexit was apparently has 3 A levels... They must be giving them away free with Cornflakes now. If true that is a dreadful indictment of the UK educational system. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the stinking enigma Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 Stop panicking. It's a reality show not reality. I blame the welsh girl from big brother that liked blinking me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted June 15, 2018 Share Posted June 15, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, RIchard Britten said: Is this the UK Brexiteers wanted? https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/man-vanish-muslim-woman-stain-remover-bleach-supermarket-islamophobia-a8399606.html How ridiculous... You know it isn't RIchard. Whatever you think about brexiters, extremists like that fella are thankfully few and far between. How that TellMAMA group have retained any credibility with British media, after the fake statistics and false reporting it continues to publish, is beyond me. Edited June 15, 2018 by quilp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 (edited) 21 hours ago, woolley said: His analogy with the millennium bug is apposite. This too was a massive scare story promulgated by vested interests Y2K was only about fixing the date field - one little thing but it needed diligent attention, careful planning, hard work and contingency. Especially, for example, in the banking and insurance sectors. There was certainly a lot of media scaremongering around Y2K. But equally there has been a lot of conspiracy waffle written since then - ignorantly dismissing the whole thing as a hoax or a con. Often in the same media. The idea of an immediate "clean" Brexit is a nonsense. In a process based world we are inevitably going to continue to be closely and fairly tightly integrated across many areas. At least for decades. In many cases there is no previous model to revert to - and Britain will be replicating essential components which did not exist pre EU. EU systems in many areas which are perfectly adequate and well tested - which Britain has already paid for but will no longer be integrated into. Politicians will have the difficult job of explaining to the electorate that the practicalities are out of step with simplistic "can do" rhetoric and passions. Brexit will never be "clean" enough for those who image a binary (in vs out) outcome. They have set themselves up to be disappointed by unrealistic expectations. Edited June 16, 2018 by pongo 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Today those who imagine a "clean" Brexit are blaming "remoaners" and "traitors" for the inevitable chaos and practicalities of leaving the EU. Though all of this was predicted. Opposition to leaving is part of the practical reality. In many ways it might be best to make Mogg PM ASAP. Then they will have nobody to blame except each other when even he is forced to make practical choices. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Conflating issues to reach a desired but flawed conclusion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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