woody2 Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 15 minutes ago, P.K. said: When are the brexit lot going to take on board the fact that if we crash out we will not be trading on "WTO terms" because we will have NO TRADING ARRANGEMENTS WITH ANYONE! What a bunch of Gordons. Just watched JRM explaining to a haulier that the UK can "streamline" customs checks at Folkestone and Dover. Unfortunately he didn't mention how or what then happens at places like Rotterdam. Also there will be a govt white paper on UK EU driving licenses that will be invalidated. No mention at all about other countries accepting them. "Economical with the truth" just doesn't even get close.... Still, if they're thick enough you can fool some of the people all of the time (Lincoln?) schedules submitted and the uk can start trading on them the second it leaves the eu..... #fakenewspk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 Everyone still hell bent on brexit ought to read this in full. Oh shit! No doubt cognitive dissonance will prompt some to usual "fake news" denial. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 2 hours ago, ballaughbiker said: Everyone still hell bent on brexit ought to read this in full. Oh shit! No doubt cognitive dissonance will prompt some to usual "fake news" denial. What a load of #fakenewsnot The idea that we can just take up trading with the countries outside of the EU we currently trade with along the lines of the EU negotiated settlements is complete and utter #bollocks. Written into their trade agreements with the EU is a clause that stipulates that they cannot even open a dialogue with another major trading nation (like the UK) without consultation with the EU first. It's called "Definitely Not Taking Back Control" or better known by the acronym FUCKED. Now is an industrialised trading nation like Japan going to risk ALL the trade it has with the worlds biggest trading block, known as the EU, just to negotiate with a lame duck like the UK, no doubt soon to be known once again as "The Sick Man of Europe" ????? It brings to mind the first meeting of the negotiation teams. On the EU side was Barnier and his team with reams and reams of briefing papers on various scenarios etc etc they had been working on. On the UK side was David Davis and his team and all they had were a collection of sickly grins. It's just pathetic.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 41 minutes ago, P.K. said: What a load of #fakenewsnot The idea that we can just take up trading with the countries outside of the EU we currently trade with along the lines of the EU negotiated settlements is complete and utter #bollocks. Written into their trade agreements with the EU is a clause that stipulates that they cannot even open a dialogue with another major trading nation (like the UK) without consultation with the EU first. It's called "Definitely Not Taking Back Control" or better known by the acronym FUCKED. Now is an industrialised trading nation like Japan going to risk ALL the trade it has with the worlds biggest trading block, known as the EU, just to negotiate with a lame duck like the UK, no doubt soon to be known once again as "The Sick Man of Europe" ????? It brings to mind the first meeting of the negotiation teams. On the EU side was Barnier and his team with reams and reams of briefing papers on various scenarios etc etc they had been working on. On the UK side was David Davis and his team and all they had were a collection of sickly grins. It's just pathetic.... #fakenewsagain nearly all of trade outside the eu done by the uk is under wto..... latest figure was just over 50% of uk trade..... the eu have never said they want to cut trade with the uk even under wto..... as for #projectfear threats of interference in uk trade, the eu can't do this under international law, they would face sanctions from across the board turning the eu into north korean...... let them try next...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 (edited) 5 hours ago, woody2 said: schedules submitted and the uk can start trading on them the second it leaves the eu..... #fakenewspk Well, yes, and no. Yes the UK has submitted draft schedules. The rest of the WTO have three months to accept. If one country doesn’t agree they aren’t accepted. Trade schedules are complicated, not just setting out the amount of tariff, but also the qualitative things like size of quotas at different rates. First orange zero, second orange 10%, 3rd .orange 25%, all other oranges 100%. Or even tariffs on oranges between December and May, but tariffs June to November ( to protect eu production ). What the UK has done is submit draft schedules exactly mirroring the EU schedules. So, if accepted there will be total alignment and no benefit from Brexit for trade outside the EU. Unfortunately it doesn’t end there. Let’s say, just suppose, that a third country has an agreement with the EU that allows it a quota of 28,000 tonnes of a particular agricultural food profit at zero tariff. How does the UK divide that up? Does it say, well the EU has 28 members, we will suggest 1,000 tonnes for us. But it can’t achieve that until the EU agrees to amend its schedule to 27,000 tonnes and the third country agrees the split. Consumption may not be per country, but per capita, or skewed, so in the case of, say, NZ lamb, most of the zero tariff quota goes to the UK. Division becomes more problematic. EU countries may say they aren’t bothered by NZ lamb quota being split 95% UK and 5% EU. But NZ and it’s producers might worry, at present it can switch market and utilise quota in, e.g., Germany if the U.K. can’t take what is expected. If the quota is split 95% to 5% they can’t allocate to a different market if the UK doesn’t take th full quota. So they won’t agree. Edited September 13, 2018 by John Wright Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 27 minutes ago, John Wright said: Consumption may not be per country, but per capita, or skewed, so in the case of, say, NZ lamb, most of the zero tariff quota goes to the UK. Division becomes more problematic. EU countries may say they aren’t bothered by NZ lamb quota being split 95% UK and 5% EU. But NZ and it’s producers might worry, at present it can switch market and utilise quota in, e.g., Germany if the U.K. can’t take what is expected. If the quota is split 95% to 5% they can’t allocate to a different market if the UK doesn’t take their full quota. So they won’t agree. Just to absolutely guarantee it won't happen let's not forget that the EU and places like NZ are having talks over trade! FFS! The real tragedy is that the expected downturn in UK fortunes will affect the most disadvantaged to the greatest degree. The engineers of this historical clusterfuck like Cameron, JRM, Johnson, Gove, Farage, Raab, Fox, Fysh, Isaby, Davis, Duncan Smith etc etc will remain largely unaffected. A plague on all their houses.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 Quote What the UK has done is submit draft schedules exactly mirroring the EU schedules So clear is that mirror that it's apparently used € in the drafts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 Farage seems to be rapidly moving away from the promised 'EU dividend' arguments and back to those convenient emotional indefinables such as sovereignty and freedom and our future greatness. He even said tonight that we would be no longer "ruled by Juncker". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 Strange and laughable as the two words seem together now, Farage and chums were actually talking about a promised ... careful, mind your sides don’t split now ... ‘Brexit dividend’. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 15 hours ago, John Wright said: Well, yes, and no. Yes the UK has submitted draft schedules. The rest of the WTO have three months to accept. If one country doesn’t agree they aren’t accepted. Trade schedules are complicated, not just setting out the amount of tariff, but also the qualitative things like size of quotas at different rates. First orange zero, second orange 10%, 3rd .orange 25%, all other oranges 100%. Or even tariffs on oranges between December and May, but tariffs June to November ( to protect eu production ). What the UK has done is submit draft schedules exactly mirroring the EU schedules. So, if accepted there will be total alignment and no benefit from Brexit for trade outside the EU. Unfortunately it doesn’t end there. Let’s say, just suppose, that a third country has an agreement with the EU that allows it a quota of 28,000 tonnes of a particular agricultural food profit at zero tariff. How does the UK divide that up? Does it say, well the EU has 28 members, we will suggest 1,000 tonnes for us. But it can’t achieve that until the EU agrees to amend its schedule to 27,000 tonnes and the third country agrees the split. Consumption may not be per country, but per capita, or skewed, so in the case of, say, NZ lamb, most of the zero tariff quota goes to the UK. Division becomes more problematic. EU countries may say they aren’t bothered by NZ lamb quota being split 95% UK and 5% EU. But NZ and it’s producers might worry, at present it can switch market and utilise quota in, e.g., Germany if the U.K. can’t take what is expected. If the quota is split 95% to 5% they can’t allocate to a different market if the UK doesn’t take th full quota. So they won’t agree. that doesn't mean the uk can't trade on them........ #johnwrongagain Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 good news...... carney says house prices will drop by 35%*..... great for the young getting on the ladder and will lower rents...... (*last time he said this prices went up) #nodeal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 meanwhile in germany.... only 447 killings or attempted killings by asylum seekers, refugees and immigrants in 12 months...... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 (edited) If property prices fall 35% look out for your pension. Any concurrent interest rate rise will likely wipe out any price drop benefit so rents will not fall. Edit....and banks will demand a higher percentage deposit forcing first time buyers to save longer. Not quite as good as it first sounds is it? Edited September 14, 2018 by ballaughbiker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 Not forgetting that it will reduce the profit margins on new builds making them a less attactive investment. Still, it would be worth it to see Paul Dacre foaming at the mouth.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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