woody2 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 9 hours ago, La Colombe said: Hmm. I'm not convinced about that. I'll believe it when it's actually happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 6 hours ago, Freggyragh said: 'It is like threading the eye of a needle. If you have a good eye and a steady hand, it is easy enough,' David Davis, December 2016, dismissing fears a Brexit deal might be difficult. Never forget the leavers had their chances to shape brexit - they held all the key ministerial positions. May’s deal is the best that Davis, Raab, Johnson, Hunt, Fox and Gove could come up with. If the U.K. exits with the current deal they’ve given away control, sovereignty, influence and money on an epic scale. Cretins. not the one in control of leaving through...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 9 hours ago, Albert Tatlock said: Theresa May earned her money today. from who...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 9 hours ago, Albert Tatlock said: Theresa May earned her money today. And her pension... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 (edited) 51 minutes ago, woody2 said: not the one in control of leaving through...... Well, he was Secretary of State for Exiting the EU and had two years to strike a better deal. Sadly, he spent most of his time chewing gum. Edited November 16, 2018 by Freggyragh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojomonkey Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 I'm assuming it is all the fault of the remaintard civil servants? Excuses, excuses, always excuses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 4 minutes ago, Freggyragh said: Well, he was Secretary of State for Exiting the EU and had two years to strike a better deal. Sadly, he spent most of his time chewing gum. and didn't control a thing- same with raab which is why he left his job...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, mojomonkey said: I'm assuming it is all the fault of the remaintard civil servants? Excuses, excuses, always excuses. oily olly has been in charge he is openly pro-eu...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 13 hours ago, mojomonkey said: People may not like it but it is still democratic. The referendum only asked about leaving the eu, it played no role in deciding the nature of leaving. The elected government have put forward a leaving agreement, apparently it's a bit shit but what do you expect from politicians? technically its not leaving te eu so anti- democratic....... technically its a no deal because its doesn't legally say what happens in the future..... it's not the #nodeal which i want....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojomonkey Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 The job of any civil servant is to carry out the wishes of the elected members. If those elected members cannot put forward their wishes (as far as there are legal and actually possible) because of a civil servant then you have to wonder why they put that civil servant in that position. I think it’s all too convenient to try to pin the failings of the MPs on the civil servants. The problem as I see it is as follows. The people voted to leave the EU, fair enough, but that vote did not specify how that leave should actually occur. Those elected to carry through the leaving process (MPs) were all so divided on what leaving should mean that reaching an actual agreement that satisfies, or is at least acceptable to, everyone is nigh on impossible. May and her Cabinet have put forward their agreement for leaving and it meets the requirements of the referendum. However, because of the many differing views on leaving it does not satisfy hardline exiters and does not satisfy diehard remainers. The result is an agreement that is pretty much disliked by all sides. If this was the Isle of Man there would be a lot of noise from elected members that it wasn’t a good agreement and then they would still vote it through. In the UK I am not so sure what will happen. If May’s agreement survives long enough to make it to a vote I honestly don’t know what will happen. Hindsight is a wonderful thing but I think it would have been much better if draft agreements had been put forward before the referendum so that people could actually have the opportunity to know what they were voting for. A simple in or out question, as was asked, was far too simplistic for something that is actually very complex. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, mojomonkey said: The job of any civil servant is to carry out the wishes of the elected members. If those elected members cannot put forward their wishes (as far as there are legal and actually possible) because of a civil servant then you have to wonder why they put that civil servant in that position. I think it’s all too convenient to try to pin the failings of the MPs on the civil servants. The problem as I see it is as follows. The people voted to leave the EU, fair enough, but that vote did not specify how that leave should actually occur. Those elected to carry through the leaving process (MPs) were all so divided on what leaving should mean that reaching an actual agreement that satisfies, or is at least acceptable to, everyone is nigh on impossible. May and her Cabinet have put forward their agreement for leaving and it meets the requirements of the referendum. However, because of the many differing views on leaving it does not satisfy hardline exiters and does not satisfy diehard remainers. The result is an agreement that is pretty much disliked by all sides. If this was the Isle of Man there would be a lot of noise from elected members that it wasn’t a good agreement and then they would still vote it through. In the UK I am not so sure what will happen. If May’s agreement survives long enough to make it to a vote I honestly don’t know what will happen. Hindsight is a wonderful thing but I think it would have been much better if draft agreements had been put forward before the referendum so that people could actually have the opportunity to know what they were voting for. A simple in or out question, as was asked, was far too simplistic for something that is actually very complex. olly was working for may in her bunker...... she wouldn't listen to anybody hence the resignations........ the referendum isn't the issue ...... may screwed up as soon as she agreed to do it the eu's way= failure........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojomonkey Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 and who voted for May to be PM? The blame lies with the elected members. Maybe things would be different if Johnson, Gove et al had not spent their time stabbing each other in the back and an exit supporter had actually become PM. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, mojomonkey said: and who voted for May to be PM? The blame lies with the elected members. Maybe things would be different if Johnson, Gove et al had not spent their time stabbing each other in the back and an exit supporter had actually become PM. avoiding all the points i have just stated morning mrs may...... the irish border should of come under the trade deal- as i have said before....... it was never going to be sorted by the withdrawal agreement...... it could still be sorted out by bilateral agreements but may's not interested........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the stinking enigma Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 It's the UK border in Ireland not the Irish border. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.