ballaughbiker Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) 19 hours ago, John Wright said: I’ve amended to fully explain. It isn’t. 21st September http://trade.ec.europa.eu/doclib/press/index.cfm?id=1911 and that is obliquely mentioned as an addendum in of of your links. Edited November 17, 2018 by ballaughbiker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, ballaughbiker said: 21st September http://trade.ec.europa.eu/doclib/press/index.cfm?id=1911 Yes, but it hasn’t joined ECOWAS and the West Africa EU agreement it has signed hasn’t been signed by Nigeria, yet, and until it is it can’t be ratified or come into effect. So at present Mauritania hasn’t got any trade agreements in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) We are splitting hairs here John. True, no FTAs but Mauritania isn't just going to entirely rely on WTO which was the original point. Whilst ratification is obviously the end point, the present situation is not the same as nothing having been done. It's a technical point and not the full story. A bit like Spanish banks making Manx residents jump through hoops because there is no information exchange agreement and 'you live in a fiscal paradise' (yeah....). However....on closer inspection we find out that our fellas from the Treasury have signed an information exchange agreement at the Spanish embassy in London a year or two back but the Spanish government haven't got round to ratifying it. Technically there is therefore no agreement, but the true story is not how the Spanish banks tell it (making out absolutely nothing has been done with the implication that we want to maintain secrecy.) Edited November 17, 2018 by ballaughbiker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 1 minute ago, ballaughbiker said: We are splitting hairs here John. True, no FTAs but Mauritania isn't just going to entirely rely on WTO which was the original point. No, no hair splitting. It currently has none and trades exclusively WTO. And until Nigeria signs, and the Agreement is ratified by EU and the 16 African states ( ECOWAS May sign for its members ) it will still be entirely WTO reliant. The question was whether there was a country without trade agreements, I listed Mauritania, you said it was in ECOWAS, it isn’t, and it still doesn’t have any trade agreements in force. Its getting there, starting from scratch. Just like UK will have to if it falls out with no deal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 You're not a lawyer by any chance are you? 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 31 minutes ago, ballaughbiker said: You're not a lawyer by any chance are you? It was your question, albeit addressed to W2.. I answered correctly. You told me I was wrong. I linked to documents showing you were wrong. You won’t accept. You’re W2. £5 please. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) Everyone reading the past page or two will make their own mind up whether your binary summing up above is reasonable (clue.....imo it aint) As for being W2, I feel quite defamed but not being a snowflake I think I'll get over it but I'll have my fiver back if you don't mind....... I would have to suffer from DID to write both my entirely reasonable posts and the tosh usually associated with his/her handle. Mr Weeble says: Others (thank you Alan Bell et al.) have take my work and investigated Mauritania further. It turns out that while they don’t have any current bilateral or multilateral free trade deals, it does benefit from preferential treatment from certain developed nations (the EU amongst them), where Mauritania’s exports in certain categories (everything but arms) are not charged import duties, but those countries goods can have tariffs added when being imported into Mauritania. As this is a form of aid for a developing country, I think that it is not something that the UK is likely to obtain, so for the purposes of debate referring to “no deal” as the “Mauritania Option” is not entirely inaccurate and could be a useful shorthand. Soooo, is the aforementioned preferential treatment an addition to WTO ? Discuss... I'll start. It is innit? Edited November 17, 2018 by ballaughbiker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 39 minutes ago, ballaughbiker said: Everyone reading the past page or two will make their own mind up whether your binary summing up above is reasonable (clue.....imo it aint) As for being W2, I feel quite defamed but not being a snowflake I think I'll get over it but I'll have my fiver back if you don't mind....... I would have to suffer from DID to write both my entirely reasonable posts and the tosh usually associated with his/her handle. Mr Weeble says: Others (thank you Alan Bell et al.) have take my work and investigated Mauritania further. It turns out that while they don’t have any current bilateral or multilateral free trade deals, it does benefit from preferential treatment from certain developed nations (the EU amongst them), where Mauritania’s exports in certain categories (everything but arms) are not charged import duties, but those countries goods can have tariffs added when being imported into Mauritania. As this is a form of aid for a developing country, I think that it is not something that the UK is likely to obtain, so for the purposes of debate referring to “no deal” as the “Mauritania Option” is not entirely inaccurate and could be a useful shorthand. Soooo, if preferential treatment an addition to WTO ? Discuss You’re definitely W2, with that degree of denial of the facts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) On 11/16/2018 at 3:34 PM, ballaughbiker said: How many countries trade on WTO only rules woody? On 11/16/2018 at 3:51 PM, John Wright said: One. Mauritania, I think, and even they are concluding their first bilateral. Not sure what N Korea does? On 11/16/2018 at 3:59 PM, ballaughbiker said: No John, Mauritania is already in the economic community of West African states and N Korea isn't in WTO. There are none (that are genuine countries) that trade solely on WTO yet it is very frequently used as something to which we should aspire. Edit : Just thought.... could we suggest a Mauritania plus plus plus deal? That should replace the EU trade and the EU negotiated WTO deals we are about to loose. 21 hours ago, John Wright said: That’s got to be recent. https://medium.com/@MrWeeble/who-actually-trades-solely-under-wto-rules-1b6127ce33c6 In fact so recent that even ECOWAS don’t list Mauritania as a member. http://www.ecowas.int/ However M, and 14 other West African states, have signed a trade agreement with the EU. M signed on 18/9/18, it still needs to be signed by Nigeria before it can be ratified and come into force. So, currently M has no trade agreements. So, Mauritania doesn’t have any agreements yet, and isn’t in ECOWAS. Developed nations, as an aid concession, waive WTO tarrifs on a discretionary basis, as a favour. i suppose after JRM, Boris, et al, plus W2 have had their way rump UK may need such handouts. Especially after Scoxit and NIxit. Edited November 17, 2018 by John Wright Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 4 hours ago, P.K. said: David Cameron faced growing Tory pressure on Europe last night when the former cabinet minister Michael Portillo threw his weight behind the call by Lord Lawson for Britain to leave the EU. As Boris Johnson entered the fray, by saying that Britain should be prepared to quit if it fails to secure better membership terms, Portillo said he "fervently" hopes the British people have the "guts" to vote he doesn't like the eu- he doesn't like referendums either...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 5 hours ago, woody2 said: does may have a legal mandate to renegotiate a new deal with the eu????????????????????????????????????????????????????? #remoanersareasking cough...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 The BBC seem to have it wrong too in November 2017: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41859691 Does any other country trade on WTO rules alone? If you look at the WTO database which lists all regional trade agreements, there is nothing for Mauritania. That's led some to suggest Mauritania is the only member to trade solely on WTO rules. However, according to the WTO, Mauritania has joined the Economic Community of West African States, and it has preferential trade arrangements with some 20 WTO members. There are some countries which aren't WTO members, including Algeria, Serbia and North Korea, but the WTO says all of its members have some sort of bilateral or regional trade agreement in place. Update: There are arrangements between the EU and 24 other countries and territories that are not related to tariffs. This article has been updated to make that clearer. So misleading Farage could have said it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballaughbiker Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 (edited) Quote So, Mauritania doesn’t have any agreements yet, and isn’t in ECOWAS. Says here it has a FTA with ECOWAS. (signed 2017) https://import-export.societegenerale.fr/en/country/mauritania/trade-country-risk Edit : Further down the page it seems to say that Mauritania also has a few bilateral trade agreements too. Edited November 17, 2018 by ballaughbiker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 its still irrelevant baldbiker..... have you seen how many the uk is signed up for...... its a shame may hasn't put the same effort into #nodeal as this daft draft...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 17 minutes ago, woody2 said: its still irrelevant baldbiker..... have you seen how many the uk is signed up for...... its a shame may hasn't put the same effort into #nodeal as this daft draft...... According to you a trade deal with the US would only take 6 months. That was in January 2017. Presumably you believed Liam Fox about how easy these trade deals would be...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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