So the UK is finished says Theresa Mayhem

[Manximus Aururaneus]

3 minutes ago, Freggyragh said:

Yes, but then we found out the brexiteers didn’t have a plan for achieving brexit and were more interested in self-publicity and promising unicorns than either planning or negotiating. Still the case. 

Could you point me in the direction of the EU's plan?

[John Wright]

12 hours ago, Manximus Aururaneus said:

UK GDP is 2.8 trillion - thats £2.8, 000,000,000,000

£60,000,000, 000 'lost' growth is but flyshit on a map - put the numbers into your calculator and be shocked.

Even if true (against positive growth and record employment numbers) it would be beyond the measuring limits and forecasts of either the Treasury or BOE

 

Project fear needs new balls and a better forecasting record - it has neither.

The only project fear is on the Brexit side, fear of foreigners, fear of sharing sovereignty, fears of rules and regulations and taxation policies that will mean fair taxes and stop evasion/avoidance by the likes of Mr May, JRM, Rothermere, Barclay brothers. 

To that end they lied to, and deceived the electorate, and are now, ideologically prepared to shaft the British economy and the vast majority of its population.

The ones who could have controlled immigration, EU and non EU, charged immigrants for medical care, could have had EU immigrants seeking work registered and made them leave, without benefits, after 3 months.

The ones who’s definition of employment ( for your record employment claim ) includes 16 & 17 year olds who should be in education, those on training schemes, interns working for free, those who stay at home and provide family services, anyone who works one hour a week.

They're the same group who’ve preached austerity for 9 years whilst cutting taxes for the wealthy and big businesses.

It doesn’t matter whether the 28 trillion is in US dollars or sterling, or whether it’s £350 million a week ( on Boris’ bus) or £440 million in the BoE estimate. 

You correctly identify that in terms of GDP it’s small beer. That works both ways. It’s so insignificant as to not be important as the UK contribution to the EU, especially bearing in mind the benefits it brings.

31 minutes ago, Manximus Aururaneus said:

It makes me a democrat P.K. i.e. Somebody who accepts the result of a legitimate vote.

It is not a concept that you will be familiar with mind.

Even if it was a legitimate vote, in a democracy no vote is forever. Over the last 120 years the average period between elections has been just over 3 years ( I’ve excluded the extended parliaments occasioned by WW1 and WW2 ).

The choice at the referendum was only ever between remain or a hard Brexit. Norway or EEA are remain in all but membership, with all the downsides without any of the say.

The leavers still dissemble and obfuscate over the true nature of WTO terms trade. Yes, only 45% trade is with EU, but if you then add trade with countries with which UK has, through the EU, bilateral, or multilateral deals, it’s 90%. 30 March WTO tarriffs of up to 30% will be imposed on 90% of UK exports. It’ll take years to negotiate replacement agreements, and UK won’t be in a strong position.

Yes, UK will have the sovereignty to declare zero tarriffs on imports into the UK, but don’t expect reciprocation and don’t forget the effect this will have on UK agriculture and industry.

When we are in the final Countdown, looking down the gun barrel of Brexit democracy demands that MP’s, who seem incapable of sorting the mess created by Cameron, May, ERG ( even JRM accepts that the benefits, if any, of Brexit, will take up to 50 years - now there’s a long term forecast - and in the meantime there’ll be hurt. ) seek a further mandate for national economic suicide.

its refusing a second vote, or closing down parliament, as demanded by JRM, that is profoundly anti democratic.

[Manximus Aururaneus]

2 minutes ago, John Wright said:

The only project fear is on the Brexit side, fear of foreigners, fear of sharing sovereignty, fears of rules and regulations and taxation policies that will mean fair taxes and stop evasion/avoidance by the likes of Mr May, JRM, Rothermere, Barclay brothers. 

To that end they lied to, and deceived the electorate, and are now, ideologically prepared to shaft the British economy and the vast majority of its population.

The ones who could have controlled immigration, EU and non EU, charged immigrants for medical care, could have had EU immigrants seeking work registered and made them leave, without benefits, after 3 months.

The ones who’s definition of employment ( for your record employment claim ) includes 16 & 17 year olds who should be in education, those on training schemes, interns working for free, those who stay at home and provide family services, anyone who works one hour a week.

They're the same group who’ve preached austerity for 9 years whilst cutting taxes for the wealthy and big businesses.

It doesn’t matter whether the 28 trillion is in US dollars or sterling, or whether it’s £350 million a week ( on Boris’ bus) or £440 million in the BoE estimate. 

You correctly identify that in terms of GDP it’s small beer. That works both ways. It’s so insignificant as to not be important as the UK contribution to the EU, especially bearing in mind the benefits it brings.

Even if it was a legitimate vote, in a democracy no vote is forever. Over the last 120 years the average period between elections has been just over 3 years ( I’ve excluded the extended parliaments occasioned by WW1 and WW2 ).

The choice at the referendum was only ever between remain or a hard Brexit. Norway or EEA are remain in all but membership, with all the downsides without any of the say.

The leavers still dissemble and obfuscate over the true nature of WTO terms trade. Yes, only 45% trade is with EU, but if you then add trade with countries with which UK has, through the EU, bilateral, or multilateral deals, it’s 90%. 30 March WTO tarriffs of up to 30% will be imposed on 90% of UK exports. It’ll take years to negotiate replacement agreements, and UK won’t be in a strong position.

Yes, UK will have the sovereignty to declare zero tarriffs on imports into the UK, but don’t expect reciprocation and don’t forget the effect this will have on UK agriculture and industry.

When we are in the final Countdown, looking down the gun barrel of Brexit democracy demands that MP’s, who seem incapable of sorting the mess created by Cameron, May, ERG ( even JRM accepts that the benefits, if any, of Brexit, will take up to 50 years - now there’s a long term forecast - and in the meantime there’ll be hurt. ) seek a further mandate for national economic suicide.

its refusing a second vote, or closing down parliament, as demanded by JRM, that is profoundly anti democratic.

Those were the arguments put forward in 2016 - you lost.

[woody2]

7 minutes ago, Freggyragh said:

Yes, but then we found out the brexiteers didn’t have a plan for achieving brexit and were more interested in self-publicity and promising unicorns than either planning or negotiating. Still the case. 

the winners did have a plan.......leave the eu.......then the remoaners jumped in and made a mess.......

[woody2]

7 minutes ago, John Wright said:

The only project fear is on the Brexit side, fear of foreigners, fear of sharing sovereignty, fears of rules and regulations and taxation policies that will mean fair taxes and stop evasion/avoidance by the likes of Mr May, JRM, Rothermere, Barclay brothers. 

To that end they lied to, and deceived the electorate, and are now, ideologically prepared to shaft the British economy and the vast majority of its population.

The ones who could have controlled immigration, EU and non EU, charged immigrants for medical care, could have had EU immigrants seeking work registered and made them leave, without benefits, after 3 months.

The ones who’s definition of employment ( for your record employment claim ) includes 16 & 17 year olds who should be in education, those on training schemes, interns working for free, those who stay at home and provide family services, anyone who works one hour a week.

They're the same group who’ve preached austerity for 9 years whilst cutting taxes for the wealthy and big businesses.

It doesn’t matter whether the 28 trillion is in US dollars or sterling, or whether it’s £350 million a week ( on Boris’ bus) or £440 million in the BoE estimate. 

You correctly identify that in terms of GDP it’s small beer. That works both ways. It’s so insignificant as to not be important as the UK contribution to the EU, especially bearing in mind the benefits it brings.

Even if it was a legitimate vote, in a democracy no vote is forever. Over the last 120 years the average period between elections has been just over 3 years ( I’ve excluded the extended parliaments occasioned by WW1 and WW2 ).

The choice at the referendum was only ever between remain or a hard Brexit. Norway or EEA are remain in all but membership, with all the downsides without any of the say.

The leavers still dissemble and obfuscate over the true nature of WTO terms trade. Yes, only 45% trade is with EU, but if you then add trade with countries with which UK has, through the EU, bilateral, or multilateral deals, it’s 90%. 30 March WTO tarriffs of up to 30% will be imposed on 90% of UK exports. It’ll take years to negotiate replacement agreements, and UK won’t be in a strong position.

Yes, UK will have the sovereignty to declare zero tarriffs on imports into the UK, but don’t expect reciprocation and don’t forget the effect this will have on UK agriculture and industry.

When we are in the final Countdown, looking down the gun barrel of Brexit democracy demands that MP’s, who seem incapable of sorting the mess created by Cameron, May, ERG ( even JRM accepts that the benefits, if any, of Brexit, will take up to 50 years - now there’s a long term forecast - and in the meantime there’ll be hurt. ) seek a further mandate for national economic suicide.

its refusing a second vote, or closing down parliament, as demanded by JRM, that is profoundly anti democratic.

what rot.......

[Freggyragh]

39 minutes ago, Manximus Aururaneus said:

Could you point me in the direction of the EU's plan?

Certainly:

https://ec.europa.eu/info/publications/communication-19-december-2018-preparing-withdrawal-united-kingdom-european-union-30-march-2019-implementing-commissions-contingency-action-plan_en

 

[Manximus Aururaneus]

2 minutes ago, Freggyragh said:

Certainly:

https://ec.europa.eu/info/publications/communication-19-december-2018-preparing-withdrawal-united-kingdom-european-union-30-march-2019-implementing-commissions-contingency-action-plan_en

 

No, I meant where is the EU's plan for itself over say 5, 10, 15 years (not the contingency planning for Brexit).

[Freggyragh]

39 minutes ago, Manximus Aururaneus said:

Those were the arguments put forward in 2016 - you lost.

Nope. Leave promised again and again that there would be a deal, that it would be easy and that it would be beneficial. All demonstrable lies. I don’t blame leavers for being taken in by the lies, but the disaster capitalists / tax dodgers / foreign governments who paid for the campaign knew they were shafting the country. Time to be a little bigger and accept you’ve been played. 

[Freggyragh]

3 minutes ago, Manximus Aururaneus said:

No, I meant where is the EU's plan for itself over say 5, 10, 15 years (not the contingency planning for Brexit).

What do you mean? What new trade deals they’re working on? How they’re going to ensure the super-wealthy pay their taxes? Or do you mean programs for government for all the constituent national governments? 

[Manximus Aururaneus]

1 minute ago, Freggyragh said:

Nope. Leave promised again and again that there would be a deal, that it would be easy and that it would be beneficial. All demonstrable lies. I don’t blame leavers for being taken in by the lies, but the disaster capitalists / tax dodgers / foreign governments who paid for the campaign knew they were shafting the country. Time to be a little bigger and accept you’ve been played. 

Nope.  It is the remainers scuttling to Brussels for behind the scenes backroom deals with the EU who are shafting the country. Treason in short.

It would have preferred a clean break - but if its going to take a war of attrition then so be it. 

[the stinking enigma]

War of attrition? Treason?  Rather a strange mindset to approach this with.

[the stinking enigma]

You strike me as someone that still believes we saved the frogs from the krauts.

[woody2]

10 minutes ago, Freggyragh said:

Nope. Leave promised again and again that there would be a deal, that it would be easy and that it would be beneficial. All demonstrable lies. I don’t blame leavers for being taken in by the lies, but the disaster capitalists / tax dodgers / foreign governments who paid for the campaign knew they were shafting the country. Time to be a little bigger and accept you’ve been played. 

well when the uk/eu gets to that stage we'll know........but it ain't even started yet..........

and that is purely down to the remoans.........

[John Wright]

13 minutes ago, Manximus Aururaneus said:

No, I meant where is the EU's plan for itself over say 5, 10, 15 years (not the contingency planning for Brexit).

Can you point to a 5, 10 or 15 year plan for any of the 27 ongoing members? 

Such long term planning tends to be connected to centralised planning of the extreme left or right. The EU has never been such a centralised body/state/federation , and so far, neither are any of its members.

[woody2]

1 minute ago, John Wright said:

Can you point to a 5, 10 or 15 year plan for any of the 27 ongoing members? 

Such long term planning tends to be connected to centralised planning of the extreme left or right. The EU has never been such a centralised body/state/federation , and so far, neither are any of its members.