woolley Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 1 hour ago, woody2 said: i blame exit........ UK employment at highest since 1971 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47622415 just look at wage growth since the vote....... Yep. Beeb has a downer on it though, as you would expect: "But with uncertainty around Brexit reaching a crescendo, firms are becoming more and more cagey over their hiring decisions." Andrew Wishart, UK economist with Capital Economics, said: "There was no sign in the labour market data of Brexit concerns at the start of the year, as the data beat expectations in every regard." Stephen Clarke, senior economic analyst at the Resolution Foundation think tank, said that Britain was closing in on Nordic employment rates and added: "While business investment has stagnated, firms are choosing instead to invest heavily in new staff." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 (edited) Whatever you thing about the deal, or indeed Brexit, Bercow is assuming a lot to himself here and is allowing his own well known prejudices to cloud his judgment. He is apparently relying on precedence going back to 1604 in making this ruling and yet he is quoted as saying in the past that if Parliament was guided only by precedent then "nothing ever would change". Will he apply a similar ruling to future repeat motions calling for a second referendum? That will be interesting. I think he will live to regret overreaching himself. Not for the first time, he has brought the office of Speaker into disrepute. Edited March 19, 2019 by woolley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 32 minutes ago, woolley said: Will he apply a similar ruling to future repeat motions calling for a second referendum? That will be interesting. There is a simple answer here and that is whether the motions put forward are pure copies of those that have already been voted on or if they have small (minuscule perhaps) changes to the details that allow him to say that there is a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, woody2 said: it pathetic how bad these eu deals are...... But so much better than the pathetic handful of deals that Fox has managed - who would have ever imagined a British politician allowing Switzerland, Iceland and Norway to dictate their own standards and regulations and much improved (for them) trading terms to the U.K., just so he’d have something to try and pass off as an achievement, well, him and his team of three junior ministers and 200 trade negotiators. Edited March 19, 2019 by Freggyragh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 8 minutes ago, Freggyragh said: But so much better than the pathetic handful of deals that Fox has managed - who would have ever imagined a British politician allowing Switzerland, Iceland and Norway to dictate their own standards and regulations and much improved (for them) trading terms to the U.K., just so he’d have something to try and pass off as an achievement, well, him and his team of three junior ministers and 200 trade negotiators. This should be the perfect wake up call concerning the extent to which vital obligations of statehood have been allowed to wither since 1973. If our performance really is so bad, then we need to improve, not meekly to accept that we are incapable and then just go on abdicating the responsibility for conducting our own affairs to the state called Europe across the channel. What a fate for the future! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 1 hour ago, woolley said: Whatever you thing about the deal, or indeed Brexit, Bercow is assuming a lot to himself here and is allowing his own well known prejudices to cloud his judgment. He is apparently relying on precedence going back to 1604 in making this ruling and yet he is quoted as saying in the past that if Parliament was guided only by precedent then "nothing ever would change". Will he apply a similar ruling to future repeat motions calling for a second referendum? That will be interesting. I think he will live to regret overreaching himself. Not for the first time, he has brought the office of Speaker into disrepute. Yes in normal circumstances I might agree. In this case though, the MVs are clearly not for the purpose of trying to move forward, they are simply a ruse to waste time. The only Brexiters that have changed their minds about the WA are the ones like Dorries and Davis who don’t understand it. What would be the point of another vote? The choices were: Shit Deal ( Norway+), Really Shit Deal (May’s), No deal, No Brexit, Second Vote, Delay. The choices now are: Shit Deal, No Brexit, Second Vote, Delay. Doesn’t matter how many miles you march on the Unicorn Trail, that’s all that’s left. I don’t think a second vote is a good idea, but if there’s a second vote there should be legislation to make it binding so any cheats would be prosecuted, there would have to be a clear plan for any leave options presented, and a plan for any remain options, including May’s half in, half out idea and the Norway + idea. A delay to this shitshow would be just about the worst option. What would be the point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 (edited) 24 minutes ago, woolley said: This should be the perfect wake up call concerning the extent to which vital obligations of statehood have been allowed to wither since 1973. If our performance really is so bad, then we need to improve, not meekly to accept that we are incapable and then just go on abdicating the responsibility for conducting our own affairs to the state called Europe across the channel. What a fate for the future! It’s not so much about skill as the hand you have. If I go shopping in Tesco, no matter how skilled a negotiator I am, I cannot haggle over prices. But when Tesco deal with their suppliers Tesco haggles, and usually wins. Do you understand how and why that might be the case? Switzerland and Norway are in Schengen, they have extensive deals with the E.U. - how are they ever going to agree better deals with the U.K. than the ones they have with the E.U.? The U.K. will never match the trade deals of the EU, no matter how skilled Fox and his team become. Edited March 19, 2019 by Freggyragh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, manxman1980 said: There is a simple answer here and that is whether the motions put forward are pure copies of those that have already been voted on or if they have small (minuscule perhaps) changes to the details that allow him to say that there is a difference. multiple times the same things has already been voted on...... he said nothing....... he has openly said he doesn't want to leave the eu..... this has nothing to do with rules...... Edited March 19, 2019 by woody2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 Just now, woody2 said: multiple times the same thing has already been voted on...... he said nothing....... he has openly said he doesn't want o leave the eu..... this has nothing to o with rules...... But what is the point? Who were you thinking might change their mind? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 34 minutes ago, woody2 said: multiple times the same things has already been voted on...... he said nothing....... he has openly said he doesn't want to leave the eu..... this has nothing to do with rules...... 32 minutes ago, Freggyragh said: But what is the point? Who were you thinking might change their mind? The joke of this is that woody2 has expressed a preference for a hard brexit on numerous occasions. I suspect that there is mock outrage at Bercow's decision but an underlying belief that this puts the prospect of a no deal all the closer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 Where do the BBC find these QT Extras? https://inews.co.uk/news/politics/fight-breaks-out-between-question-time-audience-members/ https://www.legalcheek.com/2018/05/suspended-chemsex-barrister-sells-4000-legal-advice-for-life-on-facebook/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Non-Believer Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 39 minutes ago, woody2 said: multiple times the same things has already been voted on...... he said nothing....... he has openly said he doesn't want to leave the eu..... this has nothing to do with rules...... He allowed the same motion to be brought forward twice and voted on, to be rejected on both occasions. Some might say he was being generous in allowing it twice. He has now called time on it happening a third time. Nothing wrong with that. Simply stopping a waste of parliamentary time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 4 minutes ago, Non-Believer said: He allowed the same motion to be brought forward twice and voted on, to be rejected on both occasions. Some might say he was being generous in allowing it twice. He has now called time on it happening a third time. Nothing wrong with that. Simply stopping a waste of parliamentary time. it just a shame he didn't apply the same rules to other motions...... extending art.50 x3..... labours proposal x3..... withdrawing art.50 x2..... cooper motion x2....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 15 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: The joke of this is that woody2 has expressed a preference for a hard brexit on numerous occasions. I suspect that there is mock outrage at Bercow's decision but an underlying belief that this puts the prospect of a no deal all the closer. care to show this mock outrage 5 hours ago, woody2 said: how wrong are you..... i think its a fantastic move........ it just a shame he didn't apply the same rules to other motions...... extending art.50 x3..... labours proposal x3..... withdrawing art.50 x2..... cooper motion x2....... stop making stuff up....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freggyragh Posted March 19, 2019 Share Posted March 19, 2019 Whatever you might think about the deal, or indeed Brexit, you got have laugh at these brexiters: Who’s the w*nker? https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/damian-green-sees-red-with-remain-campaigner-steve-bray-1-5940327 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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