woolley Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 5 minutes ago, Bobbie Bobster said: I get more of a sense of exasperation at this stage. Again, regardless of pros and cons there's no doubt that the issue has absorbed a huge amount of political effort that could have been diverted to other pressing problems - surely the UK can't spend another 2-3 years going around in circles? Surely not. It, at least, appears to be coming to a head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 1 minute ago, woolley said: It's never got through Parliament, Woody, except as the default position as part of the Withdrawal Act. There is no majority for it and it will keep getting knocked back. Johnson has tried a number of tricks, but as we can see, they are kicking back hard and the tide is not really running with him as he would like it to. It isn't good, because the only way you can make the EU move is if they think no deal is a real possibility. If this legislation passes today, which looks inevitable, the only way for a no deal to go through is if there is a big, hard Brexit majority in a new Parliament. Do you see that happening? I'm not convinced. we'll see if it gets queens consent.......but no deal is still the legal outcome.........the legislation won't pass today........still got to get it past the lords........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 At least we are discussing what may come to pass instead of the usual yah boo stuff. Good show! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbie Bobster Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, woolley said: Surely not. It, at least, appears to be coming to a head. I'm not so optimistic. Either result of BrexRefII will result in lots of political shenanigans due to both sides entrenched positions. And if the decision is to go ahead with leave then actually bashing out a "proper" way of doing it is likely to take some time. Edited September 4, 2019 by Bobbie Bobster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, woody2 said: we'll see if it gets queens consent.......but no deal is still the legal outcome.........the legislation won't pass today........still got to get it past the lords........ I appreciate that, but it is giving the public the impression that the executive lacks probity and a sense of fair play despite the Remain rearguard action using similar guerilla tactics since the referendum, aided and abetted by a scurrilous clown of a Speaker. Johnson is throwing away the initiative by overzealous gambits. Edited September 4, 2019 by woolley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 bj and jrm said yesterday in relation to royal assent "we will abide by constitution and law".... he also said he wasn't going to ask for a extention that only leaves the queens consent not forthcoming........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 11 minutes ago, Bobbie Bobster said: I'm not so optimistic. Either result of BrexRefII will result in lots of political shenanigans due to both sides entrenched positions. And if the decision is to go ahead with leave then actually bashing out a "proper" way of doing it is likely to take some time. ref2 is bottom of the list........they have the numbers for a vonc but not to put corbyn or anyone else as leader.........otherwise they would of gone down that route....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 4 minutes ago, woody2 said: bj and jrm said yesterday in relation to royal assent "we will abide by constitution and law".... he also said he wasn't going to ask for a extention that only leaves the queens consent not forthcoming........ It would be a curious spectacle if the government is forced to carry on solely because the opposition doesn't want an election. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 21 minutes ago, woolley said: It would be a curious spectacle if the government is forced to carry on solely because the opposition doesn't want an election. plp have just voted not to have a election.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 1 hour ago, woolley said: So do you not have a 6 month scenario to contribute then? Other than the monosyllabic "fucked"? I think Johnson might just have overreached himself at the behest of Cummings. There are a lot of people who support Brexit but are frit of no deal. The prorogation of Parliament and the withdrawal of the whip from the rebels will play well with some voters, but badly with others. I certainly don't see a net gain there. He might have been better to have taken a more relaxed line. Not prorogued, not withdrawn the whip and allowed Parliament to do its worst. No deal was never getting through which should have been patently obvious. He would have reached the same point as now, but without the opprobrium of those who are now accusing him of unseemly aggression. He could have cast Parliament as the sole wreckers of the democratic vote to leave, but now he has muddied his own waters; overplayed his hand with hubris. That will be damaging in an election. Corbyn is not good at much but he is good at coming over as the humble servant of the people at these times. He has a lot to be humble about, of course. There will obviously be an election and Boris might get a working majority, particularly if he can get a non-aggression pact with Farage, but I would guess at another hung parliament. He and Cummings are too full of themselves to seek such a deal so we will probably finish up with more lily-livered Liberals. Maybe another referendum next year. Text book example on how to cock up. It might have been a different story had Johnson taken over instead of May in 2016. More momentum (with a small "m") then to get things through, not to mention the majority bequeathed be "Call Me Dave". So thanks Mrs. May and thanks Mr. Gove. Keep the insults coming Brexit Boy! They say you get the government you deserve. Well, the Brexiteers have landed us with totally amoral narcissistic serial philanderer and inveterate liar Boris Johnson. After the brexit vote we were the basket-case country until the US Trumped us. Well, we've now moved well out in front with Johnson. The brexiteers must be so proud..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 10 minutes ago, P.K. said: Keep the insults coming Brexit Boy! They say you get the government you deserve. Well, the Brexiteers have landed us with totally amoral narcissistic serial philanderer and inveterate liar Boris Johnson. After the brexit vote we were the basket-case country until the US Trumped us. Well, we've now moved well out in front with Johnson. The brexiteers must be so proud..... 'chlorinated chicken' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 What a shit sandwich. Our Prime Minister: Johnson was also even more dishonest then usual. Corbyn said that Michael Gove told Andrew Marr that food prices would go up in the event of a no-deal Brexit. Johnson claimed Gove said no such thing. But here is the quote. Asked if food prices would go up, Gove said: Some prices may go up. Other prices will come down. FFS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 Boris Johnson blustered. It’s now a default setting. After a three-hour emergency debate that ended just before 10pm and was most notable for Jacob Rees-Mogg lying horizontal on the benches and howling for nanny while MPs responded to his sneers with icy contempt, the vote had been a formality. Twenty-one Tory MPs, including Ken Clarke, Philip Hammond and Nicholas Soames, who had served their country with an honour and integrity to which Boris could only aspire, had been as good as their word and put country before self: their political careers ended by backing a motion ruling out a no-deal Brexit their party had always said it didn’t want. Johnson had played one, lost one. A 100% record Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 3 hours ago, woolley said: Why? Does Churchill vote from beyond the grave through his grandson? What a bizarre proposition. Of course not don't be so silly. I do believe, however, that his grandson is much more likely to be able to speak for what Churchill's view would have actually been. Farage, Johnson et al certainly cannot claim to speak on Churchill's behalf and should stop referencing him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craggy_steve Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 24 minutes ago, P.K. said: What a shit sandwich. Our Prime Minister: Johnson was also even more dishonest then usual. Corbyn said that Michael Gove told Andrew Marr that food prices would go up in the event of a no-deal Brexit. Johnson claimed Gove said no such thing. But here is the quote. Asked if food prices would go up, Gove said: Some prices may go up. Other prices will come down. FFS! Your Prime Minister? Maybe. Not mine, I live in the Isle of Man ;P Instead we have HQ to put up with Seriously, I don't get why so many dwellers of Manxland get so het up about the UK Brexit farce. Just enjoy the show, what will happen will happen. We'll cope somehow. Just be thankful we don't live in the UK or come under the numpties in Westminster; the only Manxies who really need to care are the comeovers who want to go back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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