mojomonkey Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 7 minutes ago, woolley said: I think it was quite predictable given the arithmetic wasn't it? Has a PM ever taken office under such circumstances before? Don't get me wrong, I am not attacking nor defending him. I just find the effect that leaving the EU is having on the UK's political history is fascinating. What happened to May and what is happening to Johnson could have all been avoided if any thought was actually put into what action would be needed if the vote was to leave before the referendum was actually made. Cameron has to take a massive amount of responsibility for this mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 it also took the lords 9 hours to get through 13 amendments last night before labour conceded.........the outcome remains the same.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, mojomonkey said: Don't get me wrong, I am not attacking nor defending him. I just find the effect that leaving the EU is having on the UK's political history is fascinating. What happened to May and what is happening to Johnson could have all been avoided if any thought was actually put into what action would be needed if the vote was to leave before the referendum was actually made. Cameron has to take a massive amount of responsibility for this mess. they (the remoans) under cameron didn't have a plan.......neither did remoaner may's lot........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 Well whatever they tried Johnson was never going to go back to Brussels, so in that respect they are totally wasting their time writing it into law. Might as well just get on with the election because it's patently obvious that it's coming even if he has to call a confidence vote in his own government. However, I don't think any one of those involved in this is playing their - admittedly horrendous - hand well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, woody2 said: they (the remoans) under cameron didn't have a plan.......neither did remoaner may's lot........ The only plan Cameron and Europhile Whitehall had was that he wouldn't lose. He'd won 2 referenda previously and thought he was Teflon coated. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, woolley said: Well whatever they tried Johnson was never going to go back to Brussels, so in that respect they are totally wasting their time writing it into law. Might as well just get on with the election because it's patently obvious that it's coming even if he has to call a confidence vote in his own government. However, I don't think any one of those involved in this is playing their - admittedly horrendous - hand well. and still time for labour if they won to pass any law they wanted........this is just time wasting........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 3 minutes ago, woolley said: The only plan Cameron and Europhile Whitehall had was that he wouldn't lose. He'd won 2 referenda previously and thought he was Teflon coated. may and hammond wanted to deselect bj+co before the 2017 elections.......amazing how things will come back to haunt them...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 1 minute ago, woody2 said: and still time for labour if they won to pass any law they wanted........this is just time wasting........ Very true. And there is all to play for, but the Tories appear to think that Johnson has "the common touch" that resonates with voters. I don't see it. People don't like boorishness. He has no finesse whatsoever, like some grotesque upper crust caricature of Arthur Mullard. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 15 minutes ago, woolley said: Very true. And there is all to play for, but the Tories appear to think that Johnson has "the common touch" that resonates with voters. I don't see it. People don't like boorishness. He has no finesse whatsoever, like some grotesque upper crust caricature of Arthur Mullard. he's good with people on the street unlike may.........it's no accident him and corbyn are leaders.......they're very much alike......and go down well with the gp........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 We'll see, I guess. He set off with the "I'm in charge. No ifs, no buts. Let's get busy." mantra and he has crashed straight into the brick wall of parliament. How is that smart? I can understand the rationale that he is championing the result of the referendum which should have gone down well but, somehow, they have managed to make him look like the obstructive and unreasonable one. He really hasn't played it well at all. He should have said many of the same things but in a much calmer manner. Had he called an election without all of the histrionics I think he would have achieved a better result than he will now. If he can pull it off then, no doubt, all will be forgiven but from today's perspective his judgment seems suspect to me. He's being driven, and not driven carefully. He reputedly sees himself as having the gravitas of Churchill. Well, that says a lot to me about his percipience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 11 minutes ago, woolley said: We'll see, I guess. He set off with the "I'm in charge. No ifs, no buts. Let's get busy." mantra and he has crashed straight into the brick wall of parliament. How is that smart? I can understand the rationale that he is championing the result of the referendum which should have gone down well but, somehow, they have managed to make him look like the obstructive and unreasonable one. He really hasn't played it well at all. He should have said many of the same things but in a much calmer manner. Had he called an election without all of the histrionics I think he would have achieved a better result than he will now. If he can pull it off then, no doubt, all will be forgiven but from today's perspective his judgment seems suspect to me. He's being driven, and not driven carefully. He reputedly sees himself as having the gravitas of Churchill. Well, that says a lot to me about his percipience. which he wanted to do......the people Vs parliament is a easy sell......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 2 hours ago, woody2 said: 3 hours ago, Chinahand said: Hmmm. Looks like it is. at the time it wasn't......... we'll see......its now down to who wins the election.......if it's bj the bill is dead........ don't forget the legal challenge from either side...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 19 minutes ago, woody2 said: which he wanted to do......the people Vs parliament is a easy sell......... It should be. But they are quite successfully portraying themselves as the victims who are upholding democratic principles. That should be an untenable position given the history of this, but he is making it easy for them at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojomonkey Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 Johnson announces intention to stand down at next election: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-49594793 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 4 minutes ago, mojomonkey said: Johnson announces intention to stand down at next election: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-49594793 good seat for sir nige....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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