So the UK is finished says Theresa Mayhem

[woolley]

On 10/4/2019 at 1:08 AM, TheTeapot said:

I should probably check what he actually said but its bedtime and i can't be arsed. On the face of it its a really stupid thing to say

 

It's a total fabrication and, apparently, the shouts of "nonsense" from the audience were from the idiot agitator himself. Gove did not draw the analogy attributed to him at all.

ETA: Of course, this is the way that Twatter and social media in general works, so everybody draws their own conclusion, adds a little to the lie and shares it until it goes viral. That's why so many are so angry.

Edited October 6, 2019 by woolley

[woolley]

13 minutes ago, Declan said:

Well it's only 1% better than May got.

Anyway it will presumably only happen after Brexit now, so hopefully the Leaver vs Remainer dichotomy will fall away.

They would probably be happy with 1% better than Theresa May got seeing as she had 42.4% of the vote, the highest since Thatcher's "Falklands" election in 1983. Obviously they would like those votes to be redistributed a little more favourably.

I'm not so sure about the Leaver v Remainer antagonism dying down so quickly either, whatever happens. For the sanity of everyone it is nice to think that it would fall away, but I think it unlikely. The pot is coming to the boil imminently, but whichever way it overflows, there is going to be half of the population disaffected, and that ill will is not just going to vanish overnight. It will take a long time. If we don't come out it will carry on as now but worse. "We voted Leave", etc. If we do come out, there is the future relationship to establish, a can of worms if ever there was one, and there will still be hordes insisting that whatever the outcome, it will be worse than being a member.

There is no room for complacency as this will have the capacity to cause disruption to the UK for many years to come, even to make it terminally ungovernable. "What the EU does for us." indeed.

[P.K.]

16 minutes ago, Declan said:

Anyway it will presumably only happen after Brexit now, so hopefully the Leaver vs Remainer dichotomy will fall away.

 

12 minutes ago, woolley said:

Of course, this is the way that Twatter and social media in general works, so everybody draws their own conclusion, adds a little to the lie and shares it until it goes viral. That's why so many are so angry.

I doubt if the stupid brexit will ever fall away. Here, in stark relief, is one of the reasons why there is so much anger and bitterness about the whole farrago.

Talk about poles apart. It's as though they are talking about different places! One thing is for sure and that is someone has got it very wrong indeed:

The Super Soaraway Scum:

IN JUST 74 days Boris Johnson has already achieved what dithering Theresa May failed to do in three years.

He has fashioned a credible Brexit offer that could win a Commons majority, confounding critics who insisted he only wanted No Deal. 

His compromise has been carefully crafted so it is palatable to MPs from all sides who genuinely want a deal.

But as he says on these pages, it only works if the EU are willing to show they want one too.

The trouble is Parliament’s Remainers have already given the EU a get-out with the Benn “Surrender Act”. And Brussels seems happy to sit back and let the wreckers do their worst to prevent ANY deal.

The Grauniad:

Brexit: border talk stirs up bad memories in Northern Ireland

Boris Johnson’s Brexit proposals are filling those in rural County Fermanagh with dread and confusion.

Boris Johnson has revealed the UK government’s Brexit plan for a hard border between Northern Ireland and the Republic, a potentially chilling prospect for peace and prosperity on the island. The prime minister’s long-awaited proposal sent officials and politicians in Dublin, Belfast and Brussels scrambling for position in the next phase of the UK’s tortuous effort to leave the European Union.

“We’re setting up new companies on both sides of the border,” said Liam McCaffrey, CEO of Quinn Industrial Holdings, which supplies building materials. 

"Customs checks would be bad enough, but Johnson’s apparent plan to give the Stormont Assembly a veto over trading arrangements verged on surreal, said McCaffrey. Power sharing in Northern Ireland collapsed in January 2017 and shows little sign of reviving. “The future of how we trade is to be decided every four years by an assembly that hasn’t sat in three years? Bizarre.”

Jonathan Powell, Britain’s chief negotiator in Northern Ireland from 1997 to 2007, struck an ominous tone. “Be under no misapprehension, there will have to be checks and there will be a hard border which will undermine the basis on which the Good Friday agreement was built in trying to find a way of dealing peacefully with the different identities of the different communities in Northern Ireland,”

[woolley]

2 minutes ago, P.K. said:

The Super Soaraway Scum:

 

The Grauniad:

 

And seeing as both are completely unreliable and reprehensible, driving opposite agendas while feigning objectivity, we shall have to draw our own conclusions and wait and see.

[woody2]

85% of irish cross border goods trade is already tracked.......

[woody2]

40 minutes ago, Declan said:

Well it's only 1% better than May got.

Anyway it will presumably only happen after Brexit now, so hopefully the Leaver vs Remainer dichotomy will fall away.

but they won't make the mistake may made.....

outcome will depend on sir nige standing candidates........

remoan vote goes at least 5 ways.......

[Declan]

1 minute ago, woolley said:

They would probably be happy with 1% better than Theresa May got seeing as she had 42.4% of the vote, the highest since Thatcher's "Falklands" election in 1983. Obviously they would like those votes to be redistributed a little more favourably.

I'm not so sure about the Leaver v Remainer antagonism dying down so quickly either, whatever happens. For the sanity of everyone it is nice to think that it would fall away, but I think it unlikely. The pot is coming to the boil imminently, but whichever way it overflows, there is going to be half of the population disaffected, and that ill will is not just going to vanish overnight. It will take a long time. If we don't come out it will carry on as now but worse. "We voted Leave", etc. If we do come out, there is the future relationship to establish, a can of worms if ever there was one, and there will still be hordes insisting that whatever the outcome, it will be worse than being a member.

There is no room for complacency as this will have the capacity to cause disruption to the UK for many years to come, even to make it terminally ungovernable. "What the EU does for us." indeed.

Sorry, I misread the stats. She got 37% of the seats.

It's interesting you blame the EU for the disruption in UK politics, but isn't it the unnecessary decision to Leave the EU that's caused it. It's this very disruption, that was dismissed as Project Fear, that was the main reason I opposed Brexit. I could easily have accepted an orderly exit, followed by a negotiated future relationship with the EU. But the leading proponents of Brexit have done nothing to mitigate the worries of leaving, in fact they've voting against a moderate orderly exit three times and now are insisting on an unnecessary deadline to the conclusion to the current talks.

The majority of Britain probably lies in an alliance between those that voted Leave and want an orderly exit and those that voted Remain but believe in making the best of a bad job.

[woody2]

11 minutes ago, P.K. said:

 

The Grauniad:

Brexit: border talk stirs up bad memories in Northern Ireland

 

#fakenews

[woody2]

1 minute ago, Declan said:

Sorry, I misread the stats. She got 37% of the seats.

It's interesting you blame the EU for the disruption in UK politics, but isn't it the unnecessary decision to Leave the EU that's caused it. It's this very disruption, that was dismissed as Project Fear, that was the main reason I opposed Brexit. I could easily have accepted an orderly exit, followed by a negotiated future relationship with the EU. But the leading proponents of Brexit have done nothing to mitigate the worries of leaving, in fact they've voting against a moderate orderly exit three times and now are insisting on an unnecessary deadline to the conclusion to the current talks.

The majority of Britain probably lies in an alliance between those that voted Leave and want an orderly exit and those that voted Remain but believe in making the best of a bad job.

it was the remoans that caused this mess with the eu backing them.......

[P.K.]

6 minutes ago, woolley said:

And seeing as both are completely unreliable and reprehensible, driving opposite agendas while feigning objectivity, we shall have to draw our own conclusions and wait and see.

So you completely failed to notice that one has been talking to the people at the sharp end and the other has nothing but pure conjecture based on the vapourware spouted by totally amoral narcissistic serial philanderer and inverterate liar Boris Johnson and the agenda of the owner.

That explains a lot....

[woody2]

2 minutes ago, P.K. said:

So you completely failed to notice that one has been talking to the people at the sharp end and the other has nothing but pure conjecture based on the vapourware spouted by totally amoral narcissistic serial philanderer and inverterate liar Boris Johnson and the agenda of the owner.

That explains a lot....

go and look what happens with checks now in the eu.......go and look what ireland has planned for no agreement......

[Freggyragh]

1 hour ago, woolley said:

It's a total fabrication and, apparently, the shouts of "nonsense" from the audience were from the idiot agitator himself. Gove did not draw the analogy attributed to him at all.

ETA: Of course, this is the way that Twatter and social media in general works, so everybody draws their own conclusion, adds a little to the lie and shares it until it goes viral. That's why so many are so angry.

Be fair though, TheTeapot posted it and pointed out he wasn’t endorsing it as he was on his way to bed. I can’t stand slimy Gove but I had to say that there was nothing contentious in his speech. The only people pushing this story now are whingers who want to make the other side look bad.

[woody2]

25 minutes ago, Freggyragh said:

Be fair though, TheTeapot posted it and pointed out he wasn’t endorsing it as he was on his way to bed. I can’t stand slimy Gove but I had to say that there was nothing contentious in his speech.

agreed.......

25 minutes ago, Freggyragh said:

 The only people pushing this story now are whingers who want to make the other side look bad.

remoans like lammy......

[woolley]

1 hour ago, P.K. said:

So you completely failed to notice that one has been talking to the people at the sharp end and the other has nothing but pure conjecture based on the vapourware spouted by totally amoral narcissistic serial philanderer and inverterate liar Boris Johnson and the agenda of the owner.

That explains a lot....

It's who they talk to and the slant they put on it. As ever.

[woolley]

1 hour ago, Freggyragh said:

Be fair though, TheTeapot posted it and pointed out he wasn’t endorsing it as he was on his way to bed. I can’t stand slimy Gove but I had to say that there was nothing contentious in his speech. The only people pushing this story now are whingers who want to make the other side look bad.

Why post it then? But I intended no criticism of Teapot in my post. I am no great fan of Gove either despite acknowledging that he is clever. If I were Johnson, Gove would be nowhere near my cabinet after what happened in the 2016 Tory leadership election.

As for those pushing the story whingeing, perhaps, but it is only the equivalent of that being done by the "Peoples' Vote" and "Momentum" crowds all day, every day. As for making the other side look bad, the original fabrication had way more social media shares than the correction, exactly as the perpetrator planned and as is always the case.