Taxpayers to dig for £20M for Liverpool Dock

[lowell thurber]

Masts up the carnanes a pretty tall

[TheTeapot]

31 minutes ago, The Voice of Reason said:

Well I have been told ( by a man in the pub) that the tallest man made structures on the Island are the Kings Court/ Queens Court apartment buildings in Ramsey.

 

I think I was told they were the tallest residential buildings, but that a couple of church spires were taller. Can't remember when or why I was told this though.

[The Phantom]

13 hours ago, The Phantom said:

The total height of the turbine including blades will be about 150m.

Would these be the tallest structure on the Island? Where else is taller?

This was supposed to be in the Windmill Thread 😒

[Roxanne]

We knew that. 

[Two-lane]

2 hours ago, The Phantom said:

This was supposed to be in the Windmill Thread

The one in Soho?

[code99]

On 9/12/2023 at 5:02 PM, Non-Believer said:

The only possible satisfaction the public could have would be finding out where the imbecilic wasters reside and driving them off the Island one night by burning torch.

Exactly right - let the baying angry crowd brandishing proverbial pitchforks have their vengeance! Just jesting!

On a more serious note, IMHO, “Naming Names” would be a wholly inappropriate, moronic and possibly even illegal thing to do (if individual public servants are named as specifically responsible it would be an unprecedented thing to do). Of course, there needs to be an investigation about what went wrong, but because the IOM Treasury signed off on the project, they must share some responsibility. It seems to me that neither the Treasury nor the politician(s) in charge of the DOI have provided sufficient oversight of each milestone of the project to keep it on track. I would not be at all surprised if the IOMG took somewhat nonchalant approach to this project and simply hoped for the best, or something like ‘just do it’.

To make sure that lessons have truly been learned what needs to change is the culture within Government Departments i.e., to become more professional, more cooperative and more answerable (these cultural changes need to be implemented from the top). The day-to-day interactions between our politicians and the IOM civil servants need to improve; positive changes will require dedication and wisdom on all sides. An important question is “do we actually have sufficiently capable people in both the Government and CS who can implement the urgently needed changes?”

[P.K.]

Any investigation should start with whoever produced the first cost guesstimate...?

[Non-Believer]

18 hours ago, code99 said:

Exactly right - let the baying angry crowd brandishing proverbial pitchforks have their vengeance! Just jesting!

On a more serious note, IMHO, “Naming Names” would be a wholly inappropriate, moronic and possibly even illegal thing to do (if individual public servants are named as specifically responsible it would be an unprecedented thing to do). Of course, there needs to be an investigation about what went wrong, but because the IOM Treasury signed off on the project, they must share some responsibility. It seems to me that neither the Treasury nor the politician(s) in charge of the DOI have provided sufficient oversight of each milestone of the project to keep it on track. I would not be at all surprised if the IOMG took somewhat nonchalant approach to this project and simply hoped for the best, or something like ‘just do it’.

To make sure that lessons have truly been learned what needs to change is the culture within Government Departments i.e., to become more professional, more cooperative and more answerable (these cultural changes need to be implemented from the top). The day-to-day interactions between our politicians and the IOM civil servants need to improve; positive changes will require dedication and wisdom on all sides. An important question is “do we actually have sufficiently capable people in both the Government and CS who can implement the urgently needed changes?”

Almost two years ago now Alf Cannan made one of his early statements as CM. It was to the effect that IoM civil servants could not be relied upon by their politicians to give accurate or truthful information.

Damning enough in itself but one must remember that politicians are not usually given to "overstating" bad news; so it's anybody guess as to just how bad and extensive the malaise really was - and how bad it still is. It can take years to change culture and more than one elected term at that. We are more than likely still in the clutches of this cancer of our "democratic" system which will doubtless still be doing its best in some quarters to grind down this new challenge.

[Blade Runner]

4 hours ago, Non-Believer said:

Almost two years ago now Alf Cannan made one of his early statements as CM. It was to the effect that IoM civil servants could not be relied upon by their politicians to give accurate or truthful information.

Damning enough in itself but one must remember that politicians are not usually given to "overstating" bad news; so it's anybody guess as to just how bad and extensive the malaise really was - and how bad it still is. It can take years to change culture and more than one elected term at that. We are more than likely still in the clutches of this cancer of our "democratic" system which will doubtless still be doing its best in some quarters to grind down this new challenge.

Which DOI Minister asked for an independent advisor?

That says a lot in itself.

[newaccount]

 

[Derek Flint]

Make no mistake. The decision makers are the civil servants. 

In many quarters I am unsure of exactly.what politicians do on the Island. They certainly don't run the show.

[Dirty Buggane]

To be actually aware of what is going on should not be beyond the realms of a MHK, especially what is occurring within the department you are supposed to be heading. If any impropriety is happening this should also be brought to the publics notice and not be swept under a ever growing lumpy carpet and hope no one notice's. Oh and jobs should be lost and pension rights revoked, a drop I know but every little helps in reducing  the public service pension black hole. But we legally have to pay  it go's up the cry, god knows they spent enough money trying not to pay out Ranson. The only difference being I would whole heartedly be behind people  found to be in gross misconduct/ incompetence that costs the people millions of pounfs . Everybody makes mistakes, all I can say to that is you have been employed beyond your capabilites and should not of been give that promotion and pay rise if you can not do the job. 

Edited October 7, 2023 by Dirty Buggane

[monasqueen]

Going back many years, it was quite normal for people to be "promoted into incompetence".

This was particularly noticeable where people who were promoted had to be moved to a different town - move the problem away from you.

This sometimes backfired when the receiving office operated the same system, and the problem person was again promoted, and was moved back to the original office! Ouch!

Fortunately, this sort of thing is not so easy to achieve on the Island!

[Max Power]

3 hours ago, Derek Flint said:

Make no mistake. The decision makers are the civil servants. 

In many quarters I am unsure of exactly.what politicians do on the Island. They certainly don't run the show.

The politicians in almost every case are there to provide an image and veneer of democracy, nothing more than that. 

This is why there is this faux bowing and scraping to the position, as if they are really important to the machinations of government. It works at all levels, we are basically suckers for believing that we elect people to run the place and for listening intently to the drivel that we are fed!

[Non-Believer]

3 hours ago, Derek Flint said:

Make no mistake. The decision makers are the civil servants. 

In many quarters I am unsure of exactly.what politicians do on the Island. They certainly don't run the show.

At all levels Derek, including LA. Told what it is thought that they need to hear and no more. They than have to act and take the rap for their decisions on these half-stories whilst those really responsible walk away scot-free and usually rich to boot.

Edited October 7, 2023 by Non-Believer
Fat fingers