mojomonkey Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 21 minutes ago, woody2 said: well if anyone starts chanting near you or has a backpack on and looks foreign, get the first strike in and when they have a pressure release trigger (which they normally do) what is shooting them going to do? The idea that the average member of the public can do much against a suicide bomber is just stupid. I notice that llap isn't answering the question posed, but that's nothing new as he either ignores things when he is shown to be the fool he obviously is or has a big flounce. To be honest and if we want to discuss the issue properly, by the time these arseholes have picked up their bomb it is too late. The solution is to address the root source, but that is an incredibly difficult task. I'm surprised that the backlash against the police and security services over Manchester hasn't started yet. These things follow a pattern where blame is sought to be attributed. As someone else has already said the police and security services have to be successful every time, the terrorist only has to be successful one time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 9 minutes ago, RIchard Britten said: Would that be a group that was allowed to grow and spread after the death of Gadhafi? After we "helped"? "It aims to establish an Islamic state in Libya and views the Gaddafi regime as oppressive, and anti-Muslim, according to the Canadian Security Intelligence Service. LIFG claimed responsibility for a failed assassination attempt against Gaddafi in February 1996, which was in part funded by MI6 " What was it I said about Governments funding terror groups and it biting them in the arse later? you missed this part Quote according to David Shayler and this Quote In an article in the London Evening Standard in 2009, David Shayler further discussed the Messiah claim and revealed that he was living as a woman in a squat in Abinger Hammer, Surrey. His former girlfriend, Annie Machon, believes that Shayler's long battle with the intelligence services led him to suffer a breakdown.[25] Shayler has since told newspapers that his transvestite 'alter ego' is called 'Delores Kane' stop using diversion tactics rtard ffs..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 So British and American forces weren't involved in the over throw of Gadhafi? United Kingdom: The United Kingdom deployed the Royal Navy frigates HMS Westminster and HMS Cumberland, nuclear attack submarines HMS Triumph and HMS Turbulent, the destroyer HMS Liverpool and the mine countermeasure vessel HMS Brocklesby.[139] The Royal Air Force participated with 16 Tornado and 10 Typhoon fighters[140] operating initially from Great Britain, but later forward deployed to the Italian base at Gioia del Colle. Nimrod R1 and Sentinel R1 surveillance aircraft were forward deployed to RAF Akrotiri in support of the action. In addition the RAF deployed a number of other support aircraft such as the Sentry AEW.1 AWACS aircraft and VC10 air-to-air refueling tankers. According to anonymous sources, members of the SAS, SBS and Special Reconnaissance Regiment (SRR) helped to coordinate the air strikes on the ground in Libya.[141][142][143] On 27 May, the UK deployed four UK Apache helicopters on board HMS Ocean United States: The United States deployed a naval force of 11 ships, including the amphibious assault ship USS Kearsarge, the amphibious transport dock USS Ponce, the guided-missile destroyers USS Barry and USS Stout, the nuclear attack submarines USS Providence and USS Scranton, the cruise missile submarine USS Florida and the amphibious command ship USS Mount Whitney.[145][146][147] Additionally, A-10 ground-attack aircraft, B-2 stealth bombers, AV-8B Harrier II jump-jets, EA-18G Growler electronic warfare aircraft, P-3 Orions, and both F-15E[148] and F-16 fighters were involved in action over Libya.[149]U-2 reconnaissance aircraft were stationed on Cyprus. On 18 March, two AC-130Us arrived at RAF Mildenhall as well as additional tanker aircraft.[citation needed] On 24 March 2 E-8Cs operated from Naval Station Rota Spain, which indicated an increase of ground attacks.[citation needed] An undisclosed number of CIA operatives were said to be in Libya to gather intelligence for airstrikes and make contacts with rebels.[150] The US also used MQ-1 Predator UAVs to strike targets in Libya on 23 April.[151] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 Also: Shayler joined MI5 in October 1991 after responding to an oblique job advertisement in the 12 May edition of The Observer entitled "Godot isn't coming" a reference to the play Waiting for Godot in which Godot never arrives. The advert asked if applicants had an interest in current affairs, had common sense and an ability to write. Believing the job was media related, Shayler applied.[5] He started work in F branch, which dealt with counter-subversion, including the monitoring of left-wing groups and activists, where he worked vetting Labour Party politicians prior to the 1992 election, later being transferred to T branch, which handled Irish terrorism, in August 1992. While at T branch he claims that he was involved in an investigation of Sean McNulty. Shayler moved again, to G9 branch, responsible for Middle Eastern terrorism where he reportedly headed the Libyan desk as G9A/5. It was during his tenure at the Libyan desk that he claims that he learned of the MI6 plot to assassinate Libyan leader Colonel Gaddafi from his MI6 counterpart David Watson (PT16B) and Richard Bartlett (PT16) who had overall control and responsibility for the operation.[6][7] He left the service in October 1996. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 2 March 2012: United Nations Human Rights Council release their report about the aftermath of the Libyan civil war, concluding that in total 60 civilians were killed and 55 wounded by the NATO air campaign.[199] In May that same year, Human Rights Watch published a report claiming that at least 72 civilians were killed.[16] 60-70 killed...(possibly more) and we wonder "why do they hate us". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 In 2015 through 2016 the British parliament's Foreign Affairs Select Committee conducted an extensive and highly critical inquiry into the British involvement in the civil war. It concluded that the early threat to civilians had been overstated and that the significant Islamist element in the rebel forces had not been recognised, due to an intelligence failure. By summer 2011 the initial limited intervention to protect Libyan civilians had become a policy of regime change. However that new policy did not include proper support and for a new government, leading to a political and economic collapse in Libya and the growth of ISIL in North Africa. The Foreign Affairs Select Committee saw no evidence that the UK Government carried out a proper analysis of the nature of the rebellion in Libya and it "selectively took elements of Muammar Gaddafi’s rhetoric at face value; and it failed to identify the militant Islamist extremist element in the rebellion. UK strategy was founded on erroneous assumptions and an incomplete understanding of the evidence".[239] The former Prime Minister David Cameron was ultimately responsible for this British policy failure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 13 minutes ago, mojomonkey said: To be honest and if we want to discuss the issue properly, by the time these arseholes have picked up their bomb it is too late. The solution is to address the root source, but that is an incredibly difficult task. I'm surprised that the backlash against the police and security services over Manchester hasn't started yet. These things follow a pattern where blame is sought to be attributed. As someone else has already said the police and security services have to be successful every time, the terrorist only has to be successful one time. the problem is we have sympathizers like you and rtard that want to discuss everything else but the cause, they shouldn't be in the uk fullstop, if they go to conflict zones don't let them back in... i did hear a ex-labour mp state yesterday that education is the key, well its not he was born in the uk, went through the education system to uni level and still did this and he is not the first bomber to do so.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 2 minutes ago, woody2 said: discuss everything else but the cause, You mean the other causes than "our" failed overseas policy that has created an environment for radicals to flourish and expand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojomonkey Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, woody2 said: the problem is we have sympathizers like you and rtard that want to discuss everything else but the cause, they shouldn't be in the uk fullstop, if they go to conflict zones don't let them back in... i did hear a ex-labour mp state yesterday that education is the key, well its not he was born in the uk, went through the education system to uni level and still did this and he is not the first bomber to do so.... I've no idea why you think I'm a sympathiser, I am not and have never have been. Please stop your farcical suggestion that I am, I know that you are only doing so to attempt to provoke a reaction (for whatever reason that's a thing for you) but it is tasteless, unwarranted and adds nothing to the overall discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, mojomonkey said: I've no idea why you think I'm a sympathiser, I am not and have never have been. Please stop your farcical suggestion that I am, I know that you are only doing so to attempt to provoke a reaction (for whatever reason that's a thing for you) but it is tasteless, unwarranted and adds nothing to the overall discussion. not true at all and using diversion tactics ain't going to work, now answer the point posted...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojomonkey Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 Just now, woody2 said: not true at all and using diversion tactics ain't going to work, now answer the point posted...... Answer what point? Identify the question being asked and I'll gladly answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Sausages Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 8 minutes ago, woody2 said: i did hear a ex-labour mp state yesterday that education is the key, well its not he was born in the uk, went through the education system to uni level and still did this and he is not the first bomber to do so.... That doesn't mean the education he received was any good. I'll bet nobody encouraged him to challenge his own indoctrinated religious beliefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woody2 Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 4 minutes ago, RIchard Britten said: You mean the other causes than "our" failed overseas policy that has created an environment for radicals to flourish and expand? why are you going on about libya when his brother has said it was because of syria..... they shouldn't be in the uk in the first place, problem solved..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Down Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 hour ago, RIchard Britten said: You mean like how jet pilots and drone pilots "bravely" kill and destroy the lives of hundreds of people? Do they do this randomly then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIchard Britten Posted May 25, 2017 Share Posted May 25, 2017 1 minute ago, woody2 said: why are you going on about libya when his brother has said it was because of syria..... they shouldn't be in the uk in the first place, problem solved..... Well you brought up the LIFG... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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