Time To Change The Law On Drugs?

[Rog]

24 minutes ago, ecobob said:

Ah yes, Duterte.  The man who declared he 'should have been first' in the gang rape of an Australian missionary…

This is the man who for you is a role model?

Only in his approach to drugs.  

[Rog]

23 minutes ago, ecobob said:

And really, take a close look at the regime there. It may have cut down (literally) the amount of drug dealers on the streets but the repercussions from that regime have been huge a far reaching.  And then there's the question of culture. It would never happen here.  You know this. So it's a non starter.  Unless you want to start it yourself?  Vigilante style? See how you get on?

The repercussions of drug use are even worse.  Could it happen here?  One can but hope.

[ecobob]

Hope's not enough.  You need to get out on the streets right now Rog. You can save us. (you might need to take a flask and some sandwiches).

[Rog]

13 minutes ago, ecobob said:

Hope's not enough.  You need to get out on the streets right now Rog. You can save us. (you might need to take a flask and some sandwiches).

Interestingly over here there is a growing grass roots opposition to drug use and even more so drug dealers even in the less decent parts of major towns.  Drug dealers being shopped to the police by members of the public are on the rise in addition to the young people who are also kicking back against the drug scene dobbing them in.

On the down side the scum in London are trying to set up hubs outside the scum parts of London but increasingly they're failing as decent people are identifying them as they crop up especially as an increase in the numbers of the users are low life and assorted immigrants.

So there IS hope that decency will overcome stupid hedonists, criminals, and low life scum.  Encouraging this will help big time, ignoring it or acquiesce to the criminality will not.

[yootalkin2me]

1 hour ago, Rog said:

Very true but their customer base would be significantly reduced by installing raw fear of the consequences of being discovered in the customers.

And I do mean fear.  

Hardtime in hard prison, long term consequences of being discovered, exclusion from certain employment, cancellation of driving licenses, confiscation of property up to and including houses - and more. Not time to get soft with drug CRIMINALS but to get incredibly HARD.

But decriminalising/ending the prohibition would reduce the number of illegal dealers even more than harsh penalties, plus as said previously, the tax take will more than pay for the negative impacts of drug abuse/use tgat society will inevitably shoulder but less shouldering than if still prohibited. Only a full time full on moron isn't able to see that our current stance isn't working and won't ever work.

I think Rog that you are a massive killjoy/buzzkill and that living with or near you must be the most miserable of tortures known to man, more so than listening to Chinahand give one of his 'brief' explanations. 

[woody2]

1 hour ago, ecobob said:

it wouldn't work  Its never worked.  Even in countries where they do just as you advocate.  It doesn't work. It's never worked.  It's cost us millions and millions of pounds already and it's not working.  You're supposed to be intelligent.  Why would you advocate doing the same old guff when it's been proved for years that it doesn't work? What works?  Decriminalisation. Look at the countries that have done this.  The money being used for the 'war on drugs' is now being used to help addicts, not persecute them.  Persecution has never worked for anything ever - but still you bang the same old drum.  I don't even think you come here to debate and learn.  All you seem to want to do is be inflammatory and take the opposing view.  Lord Falconer who knows more than most is catching up to this new reality but you are too blinkered to see.  Far from having a solution to the problem all you do is perpetuate the problem.  Wouldn't you prefer, just for once, to be part of the solution and not the problem itself?

see the philippines......

[Mr. Sausages]

Rog needs those little blue pills to get incredibly HARD these days.

[woody2]

9 minutes ago, yootalkin2me said:

But decriminalising/ending the prohibition would reduce the number of illegal dealers even more than harsh penalties, plus as said previously, the tax take will more than pay for the negative impacts of drug abuse/use tgat society will inevitably shoulder but less shouldering than if still prohibited. Only a full time full on moron isn't able to see that our current stance isn't working and won't ever work.

I think Rog that you are a massive killjoy/buzzkill and that living with or near you must be the most miserable of tortures known to man, more so than listening to Chinahand give one of his 'brief' explanations. 

what just like it did to the gun trade........

[Neil Down]

15 minutes ago, yootalkin2me said:

But decriminalising/ending the prohibition would reduce the number of illegal dealers even more than harsh penalties, plus as said previously, the tax take will more than pay for the negative impacts of drug abuse/use tgat society will inevitably shoulder but less shouldering than if still prohibited. Only a full time full on moron isn't able to see that our current stance isn't working and won't ever work.

I think Rog that you are a massive killjoy/buzzkill and that living with or near you must be the most miserable of tortures known to man, more so than listening to Chinahand give one of his 'brief' explanations. 

His comments are every bit as valid as yours or mine or anybody else's for that matter. Like one or two others on here, why do you feel the need to personally insult somebody?

Back on topic, have you ever had to deal with the fallout of a loved one involved in drugs?

[Mr. Sausages]

Yeah, I’ve seen some pretty bad hangovers.

[paul's got wright]

2 hours ago, Neil Down said:

You can forget that, I'm not paying over the odds for my fix of blancmange....

Wouldn't want to eat into that brown fund eh nelly!

[ecobob]

1 hour ago, Rog said:

 

So there IS hope that decency will overcome stupid hedonists, criminals, and low life scum.  Encouraging this will help big time, ignoring it or acquiesce to the criminality will not.

And what about the 'decent' people themselves? Don't know how it is for you over in Bernard Mathew land but here we have huge swathes of what you might consider to be decent people taking drugs on a regular basis.  Not just musicians and arty creative types but teachers, lawyers, politicians, nurses, doctors, architects, accountants, farmers, firemen (and women), psychologists, college lecturers, members of the IOM constabulary, churchgoers… all of whom you might assume to be 'decent' and normally law abiding people - apart from the fact that they take drugs.  Following your benchmark, do they all fall from grace and instead of remaining decent are now scum in your opinion?  I've said before, you will never understand this.  You are far too far removed from the reality of the situation to find a solution. Your views are more of a problem than the individuals themselves. If you want another country to look at look closer to home to a country in Europe.  Look at the model Portugal has created. No short sharp shocks there just common sense and guess what, it's working!

 

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/dec/05/portugals-radical-drugs-policy-is-working-why-hasnt-the-world-copied-

ithttp://time.com/longform/portugal-drug-use-decriminalization/

https://mic.com/articles/110344/14-years-after-portugal-decriminalized-all-drugs-here-s-what-s-happening#.zI1Hcm4pC

[ecobob]

1 hour ago, woody2 said:

see the philippines......

I've seen the Philippines.  It's a shit regime..  Why do you think so many of them are over here running nursing homes and working the tills at TESCO.

[woody2]

46 minutes ago, ecobob said:

I've seen the Philippines.  It's a shit regime..  Why do you think so many of them are over here running nursing homes and working the tills at TESCO.

better wages.......

[gettafa]

The Philippines had a Legislative Council too, but in line with many countries of the day, got rid of it. But the country was that corrupt they had to reinstate it.

The voting system is rigged as can be apparently. Imagine the Philippino who came to work on the wonderful Isle of Man, he was so pleased to receive a voting card saying that he could now take part in our elections....then proudly attend at the polling station only find that Buster had robbed his vote.