La_Dolce_Vita Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 You're not understanding what I mean, as maybe I haven't explained it well. I am not talking about people being stopped from choosing a church. I am talking about how we as a society should deal better with these bullshit beliefs, maybe in a similar way that we do with horoscopes or, better, hearing about the fallacies of thought that lead people to gamble money or get wrapped up in conspiracy theories. We treat Christianity with a respect that it isn't due and that sort of thinking only helps to get people wrapped up in these beliefs. If a friend came up to you and said they believed in manx fairies, you'd hopefully pick at that to work out what's going on there. How do they have evidence for this? And we might find ourselves still a bit creeped out that this is serious, unless you have good evidence. We just don't do that much in Christianity. It's ignorance largely. We think that tradition and popularity gives these things some credence and we don't realise the profound effect they have on people's lives. All I am saying is that we as a society should be more adult and compassionate about we treat others. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 4 minutes ago, La_Dolce_Vita said: All I am saying is that we as a society should be more adult and compassionate about we treat others. You don’t seem to be compassionate as you’re thrashing peoples beliefs as not believable, wrong etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boo Gay'n Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 43 minutes ago, Banker said: You don’t seem to be compassionate as you’re thrashing peoples beliefs as not believable, wrong etc Faith is the continuance of belief in the absence of evidence. It seems to me perfectly fair to question, if not challenge that approach at 'church' (to include all religious institutions) level - rather than necessarily having a go at individuals. Regarding Christianity in particular, I am appalled at the continuing reliance on its 'holy book' to justify horrific anti-human sentiments, which then lead to awful mistreatment of people and, sometimes, their deaths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoTail Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 Surely the most important thing is for religion to have no undue influence on government or education. That is why the Bishop should not have any vote in government. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Phantom Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 2 hours ago, La_Dolce_Vita said: We as a society should deal better with these bullshit beliefs, maybe in a similar way that we do with horoscopes or, better, hearing about the fallacies of thought that lead people to gamble money or get wrapped up in conspiracy theories. We treat Christianity with a respect that it isn't due and that sort of thinking only helps to get people wrapped up in these beliefs. If a friend came up to you and said they believed in manx fairies, you'd hopefully pick at that to work out what's going on there. How do they have evidence for this? And we might find ourselves still a bit creeped out that this is serious, unless you have good evidence. We just don't do that much in Christianity. It's ignorance largely. We think that tradition and popularity gives these things some credence and we don't realise the profound effect they have on people's lives. All I am saying is that we as a society should be more adult and compassionate about we treat others. So gods are bad and people should have their beliefs critiqued, but not if they believe in 73 different genders or think they're a dog? Some pretty bizzare double standards in society nowadays. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 29 minutes ago, The Phantom said: So gods are bad and people should have their beliefs critiqued, but not if they believe in 73 different genders or think they're a dog? Some pretty bizzare double standards in society nowadays. "Believing" in things that appear to be validated by the science, and not believing things that don't, is not a double standard. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hissingsid Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 So science has validated there are 73 different genders ? Why don’t these scientists concentrate on something useful like the cure for dreadful diseases. I remember a few years ago scientists at a University came up with a beauty….baked beans make you fart….. how long and how much money was wasted on that conclusion god only knows. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bombay Bad Boy Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 45 minutes ago, The Phantom said: So gods are bad and people should have their beliefs critiqued, but not if they believe in 73 different genders or think they're a dog? Some pretty bizzare double standards in society nowadays. It's not that they have beliefs. If you want to be part of a religion, or say that you identify as a goldfish, that's fine. It's that you get to vote on Island political or economic policy because you have a belief, and not any mandate from the masses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 5 minutes ago, hissingsid said: So science has validated there are 73 different genders ? Why don’t these scientists concentrate on something useful like the cure for dreadful diseases. I remember a few years ago scientists at a University came up with a beauty….baked beans make you fart….. how long and how much money was wasted on that conclusion god only knows. The science seems to suggest that gender is a spectrum. Trying to delineate that into 70odd groups is misguided. There are lots of scientists studying lots of different things, including curing dreadful diseases. I would've thought you already knew that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ativa Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 7 minutes ago, hissingsid said: So science has validated there are 73 different genders ? Why don’t these scientists concentrate on something useful like the cure for dreadful diseases. I remember a few years ago scientists at a University came up with a beauty….baked beans make you fart….. how long and how much money was wasted on that conclusion god only knows. Correct. No science has validated there are 73 genders as gender is nothing to do with science. Maybe a little research would give you a better understanding? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 5 minutes ago, Ativa said: gender is nothing to do with science The psychologists are going to be upset with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackwhite Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 This thread is embarrassing and I’m surprised it’s still going. Another thread on here about businesses closing running at 261 pages. Yet we have this which would make anyone opening a business here think twice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 10 minutes ago, jackwhite said: Yet we have this which would make anyone opening a business here think twice. Only if the business profits support a weird cult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 1 hour ago, The Phantom said: So gods are bad and people should have their beliefs critiqued, but not if they believe in 73 different genders or think they're a dog? Some pretty bizzare double standards in society nowadays. It's not about 'gods are bad', it's about believing things without good evidence is bad. The fact that there is no good evidence and therefore no good reason to believe in the Christian God means that belief in this God is a bad thing. The same with other gods where evidence is lacking. Why shouldn't all beliefs be critiqued or evaluated to see whether they are true or not? That's what we normally do, otherwise we wouldn't know what is true. The thing about genders is still about truth and evidence but it's the evidence needed is very different. And the problem is defining what gender actually is and what it means to be certain genders. (Completely outside of this conversation,this 73 genders shouldn't be treated with a pinch of salt. There is no evidence that there are. It can be instantly dismissed. Nobody has done any study to get to that number. It might be that there are many genders and those who disagree with there being just man and woman can at most say that there more than two and that these genders shift and change over time. Claiming some fixed numbers like 73 is just nonsense.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted March 27, 2023 Share Posted March 27, 2023 2 minutes ago, La_Dolce_Vita said: It's not about 'gods are bad', it's about believing things without good evidence is bad. The fact that there is no good evidence and therefore no good reason to believe in the Christian God means that belief in this God is a bad thing. The same with other gods where evidence is lacking. Is a child's belief in Father Christmas bad? Or a fan's belief that his team will beat a more successful opponent? Or a viewer's belief that a painting is uplifting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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