thesultanofsheight Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 (edited) 9 hours ago, ecobob said: Wouldn’t you expect the CM to make it clear all his team should do the same - including RC? No I wouldn’t. As I said they’re all independents. There is no party whip or line. One singular MHK making a complete tit out of themselves on Facebook is of no concern to the CM I’d say - especially if they aren’t even a Minister. He’s not even on COMIN so it’s got nothing to do with the CM really. Best advice would be to just stop posting embarrassing shite. Edited September 9, 2019 by thesultanofsheight 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopek Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 We elect these people and then we hate them. No need to make a career of it!!! 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesultanofsheight Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 7 minutes ago, Kopek said: We elect these people and then we hate them. Hate is a strong word. It’s more like a vicarious embarrassment via social media osmosis I’m sure in most cases. It’s like everyone else in the world can see how awful and inappropriate his seemingly delusional postings are from a safe distance but sadly he can’t seem to see it for himself. You can’t blame the CM or anyone else other than the person who wakes up in the morning and says “I’m going to post this on Facebook today because this is what my ego is telling me other people will think is important. Because it’s about me!” 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecobob Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 (edited) What if it’s not ego. What if it’s really just that he can’t see the truth. What if he’s actually trying really really hard and really does believe he’s doing the right thing? Some people get fixated on a certain point of view and cannot look beyond it. We’ve got some on here. Of course you could be right and maybe he is just a self absorbed ego maniac. I’m just tying to be kind and play devil’s advocate I guess. I take your point re direction and I can understand where you are coming from but I’m not sure I could agree. Regardless of his stature within the house I still think the CM should be able to rein someone in who is making a bit of a laughing stock of themselves as it reflects on government as a whole. But we can agree to differ on that. Edited September 8, 2019 by ecobob 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopek Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 4 minutes ago, ecobob said: I still think the CM should be able to rein someone in who is making a bit of a laughing stock of themselves a So, Dictatorship then? You don't seem to understand the need for a free thinking HoKs that will independently assess the proposals before them. Already most are under the financial reward of being 'good boys and girls' and now they are ti be further curtailed in what they can write on a fatuous blog on Facebook? Switch it off, try PornHub!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesultanofsheight Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 (edited) 27 minutes ago, ecobob said: Regardless of his stature within the house I still think the CM should be able to rein someone in who is making a bit of a laughing stock of themselves as it reflects on government as a whole. But we can agree to differ on that. Who else should they also be reigning in and consciously protecting? Harmer? Moorhouse? Cregeen? They all make complete tits out of themselves. How is Callister a special case? They have no duty to protect anyone. They’re all independents and therefore responsible to themselves for the way they project themselves to the public. If they get it wrong tough. Edited September 8, 2019 by thesultanofsheight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 1 hour ago, Grounds Keeper Willy said: Thanks for clarifying. I thought it was displaying impaired empathy and disinhibited and egotistical traits. Is that a psychopath? Oh sociopaths and psychopaths have those traits as well. It's just that sociopaths tend to be more manipulative. They understand, they 'know what buttons to press', they just don't really care about the consequences for other people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 18 minutes ago, Kopek said: So, Dictatorship then? You don't seem to understand the need for a free thinking HoKs that will independently assess the proposals before them. Already most are under the financial reward of being 'good boys and girls' and now they are ti be further curtailed in what they can write on a fatuous blog on Facebook? Switch it off, try PornHub!!! Claiming they're all "independents" as if it might somehow isolate Callister's behaviour from the rest of them is a nonsense. They're all members of Tynwald and with that should come a level of gravitas and decorum as befits a high level of public office. OK it's Toyland but these clowns are in charge of health, education, policing etc etc - stuff that matters! Corkill was mired in a grants scandal but he hung on by his fingernails until he had to go. The puking on the bus incident should have been instant dismissal because it showed a complete lack of respect for the position held. Quayle and Charters etc etc. It's just pathetic... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 36 minutes ago, ecobob said: What if it’s not ego. What if it’s really just that he can’t see the truth. What if he’s actually trying really really hard and really does believe he’s doing the right thing? Some people get fixated on a certain point of view and cannot look beyond it. We’ve got some on here. Of course you could be right and maybe he is just a self absorbed ego maniac. I’m just tying to be kind and play devil’s advocate I guess. You're probably right about it just being inappropriate 'over-sharing' rather than egomania. And it's certainly not Quayle's job to tell him about looking stupid, mainly because he's hardly one to talk, himself. But that's what friends are for, surely? Maybe they are actually interested in his holidays and don't realise that is a minority view. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecobob Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 10 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said: Oh sociopaths and psychopaths have those traits as well. It's just that sociopaths tend to be more manipulative. They understand, they 'know what buttons to press', they just don't really care about the consequences for other people. All Cluster B personality disordered types display those traits, psychopaths, sociopaths, narcissists, borderline personality disorders, anti social, histrionic, they all follow the same modus operandi more or less but at different levels of the spectrum and with the hope of different outcomes. Sociopaths and psychopaths are indeed more manipulative and calculated. Some act on a primeval instinct to avoid shame. I’ve known many narcissists who have no idea what they are, they act purely on instinct - but not all of course It’s a fascinating subject. Unless you find yourself embroiled with one - or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecobob Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 32 minutes ago, thesultanofsheight said: Who else should they also be reigning in and consciously protecting? Harmer? Moorhouse? Cregeen? They all make complete tits out of themselves. How is Callister a special case? They have no duty to protect anyone. They’re all independents and therefore responsible to themselves for the way they project themselves to the public. If they get it wrong tough. Yes. You’re right. All of those you’ve mentioned are an embarrassment and they also run free and unhindered - or st least so it seems. :/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecobob Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 12 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said: You're probably right about it just being inappropriate 'over-sharing' rather than egomania. And it's certainly not Quayle's job to tell him about looking stupid, mainly because he's hardly one to talk, himself. But that's what friends are for, surely? Maybe they are actually interested in his holidays and don't realise that is a minority view. Perhaps we are the minority. Perhaps it is us who live in a bubble and not they. But somehow I doubt it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesultanofsheight Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, P.K. said: Claiming they're all "independents" as if it might somehow isolate Callister's behaviour from the rest of them is a nonsense. Who said that? It’s the opposite in that you can’t expect one person to receive special treatment as some sort of special needs case when other independent politicians seem to frequently embarrass themselves on social media too as well. It’s not the CMs responsibility when they’re all independents. They aren’t his party members. They are responsible for their own social media output as independent politicians affiliated to no centralized political party. Edited September 9, 2019 by thesultanofsheight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 1 minute ago, thesultanofsheight said: Who said that? It’s the opposite in that you can’t expect one person to receive special treatment as some sort of special needs case when other independent politicians seem to frequently embarrass themselves on social media too as well. It’s just that one seems to be especially good at it. It’s not the CMs responsibility when they’re all independents. They aren’t his party members who he is responsible for. They are responsible for their own social media output. I said it. The CM is ultimately responsible for ALL of their actions. Sure without a "sweetener" being paid then the CM has little by means of leverage but there's nothing stopping him from having a few words with some folks about their behaviour. Or a lot of words in some cases.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesultanofsheight Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 (edited) 7 hours ago, P.K. said: I said it. The CM is ultimately responsible for ALL of their actions. Sure without a "sweetener" being paid then the CM has little by means of leverage but there's nothing stopping him from having a few words with some folks about their behaviour. Or a lot of words in some cases.... Callister isn’t even a Minister. He has no responsibility as part of COMIN so the answer is “no”. What could the CM possibly be responsible for in terms of advice to a back bencher? I’d stretch it perhaps that the CM has some sort of vicarious responsibility for the conduct of Ministers who form part of his Cabinet of Ministers. But back benchers? Edited September 9, 2019 by thesultanofsheight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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