Newbie Posted October 24, 2022 Share Posted October 24, 2022 On 10/23/2022 at 3:06 AM, Chie said: Have you read the Cass report? Like, not the various websites claiming what it says, the actual report itself? It's not what you think. It's not a piece of anti trans vitriol, that's just what the TERF brigade is claiming it is. It addressed issues surrounding access to treatment for trans kids, treatment options, waiting lists and more etc etc and the end result was Tavistock closing and the eventual opening of multiple regional centres that will give trans kids way better access to treatment and therapy. Those of us in the trans community are actually celebrating this as even we thought Tavistock, through no fault of its own really given the sheer size of the waiting list and lack of extra funding and care from the NHS/Government, was a shit show. Yes I have read it. At least the Interim Report, which is the only one that has been published so far (at least as far as I am aware). I agree that it isn't anti trans vitriol, and I never suggested that it was. Contrary to what you say, that isn't what I think. It makes some very sensible suggestions. It does however illustrate that gender identity issues in children and adolescents are complex, and that there are pitfalls in the approach that was adopted by the Tavistock. It also gives an insight into how professionals working there who tried to raise concerns were treated. I raised it in the context of another post that seemed to give a very one sided view of the problems faced by young people with gender identity issues, and how they should be approached. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Ship Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 On 10/23/2022 at 3:27 AM, Chie said: ... As an example, you have figures such as Posie Parker recently stating that it is acceptable to buddy up with hardcore right leaning individuals who are against female bodily autonomy if it means destroying the trans agenda. As shown, in proof, by the attendees of her recent UK events. Meaning, she is literally willing to forego the right to choose what she does with her own body if it means destroying trans people... I don't really keep up to date with all of this, but can you explain what you mean by (apparently) saying that Posey Parker has some agenda directed towards "destroying trans people"? To talk of her wanting to destroy trans people sounds a bit like emotive hyperbole to me. Have you evidence of that, or do you only have evidence of her arguing quite strongly that transwomen are not women? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 On 10/23/2022 at 3:27 AM, Chie said: 99.9% of all rape of a woman or child is committed by a cis male, that includes 99.9% of all rapes in a toilet. These are simple facts and all researchable Do you have evidence to support that? I am genuinely interested. In the UK at least, the most recent ONS figures relating to rape perpetrators do not include data relating to gender identity. They are broken down by biological sex, rather than by how the individuals identify. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passing Time Posted October 25, 2022 Share Posted October 25, 2022 14 hours ago, quilp said: Pointless. https://freethinker.co.uk/2022/10/the-falsehood-at-the-heart-of-the-trans-movement/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chie Posted October 27, 2022 Share Posted October 27, 2022 On 10/24/2022 at 6:30 PM, quilp said: Pointless. https://freethinker.co.uk/2022/10/the-falsehood-at-the-heart-of-the-trans-movement/ Sonia Sodha is yet another anti trans gender critic etc etc *insert term here*. Her words hold no weight in the face of the overwhelming vitriol thrown at the trans and wider LGBTQIA+ community by those she supports and those who support her in return. A few points that I have made several times before.. 1. No one is saying that a biological woman is not a woman. 2. We do actually acknowledge biological sex contrary to what all these morons want to claim. We also acknowledge that biological sex is vastly more complicated than XX or XY. I am not going back into this again, there are numerous posts on here of me explaining this and any amount of research you can do on the subject. 3. Bigot would be an apt word given its literal meaning is "one who is prejudiced against or antagonistic towards a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group". The difference between us and them, we won't hate you for simply being yourself and trying to live your best life, they do. If someone is bullying you or harassing you for simply being different, we would step in and defend you, they wouldn't. And it is now infringing on the rights and privacy of women worldwide as seen by what is currently happening in the US in regards to cis girls being viciously hounded and investigated for simply being good at sports. This is not a result of our actions, it's a result of theirs. If you don't want to see the damage they do, that's your issue. But, the company they keep these days is very telling of what will ACTUALLY happen to women rights once they are done. 4. No one is abandoning their critical facilities. Everyone acts like transgenderism only appeared in 2017 and suddenly "THE WORLDS GONE MAD WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN". It's been a known medical condition for decades, acknowledged by numerous professionals and academics and is evident throughout recent history and the ancient world. We are the odd ones out in human history. Again, I have numerous posts explaining this so not going back into it. 5. I am more than aware that there is a healthy portion of blame to be applied to those on the far left who have riled up the gender critics in return and contributed towards this issue exploding the way it has. However, those on the far left that you see on twitter, YouTube and who the mainstream media likes to give significant and often twisted platforms to, are a minority. The majority of us are actually quite amicable individuals who would sit down and have a sensible conversation if the world would allow it. You shouldn't listen to anything from the mainstream media or gender critics on this subject. Graham Norton recently got it right when he said that you should listen to trans people and medical professionals to understand trans issues. Listening to the mainstream media or whatever nonsense Rowling wants to throw at the world today is the equivalent of "Some bloke down the pub who owns a Bentley told me". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chie Posted October 27, 2022 Share Posted October 27, 2022 On 10/25/2022 at 2:27 AM, Ghost Ship said: I don't really keep up to date with all of this, but can you explain what you mean by (apparently) saying that Posey Parker has some agenda directed towards "destroying trans people"? To talk of her wanting to destroy trans people sounds a bit like emotive hyperbole to me. Have you evidence of that, or do you only have evidence of her arguing quite strongly that transwomen are not women? There is any amount of evidence if you watch her videos or live streams. It would be too much work to pull up every single video, live stream or interview of hers and go through each one and post them here. I have mentioned a few of them before in recent posts and in the last couple of months she has been making comments about eradicating trans people. If you really want to learn more about Posie, you should check out who she aligns herself with and some of the excuses she gives herself for doing it. That association, the excuses and what those people actually stand for and want is utterly horrifying and terrifying and is going to cause more damage to human rights than anything the gender critics are currently claiming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chie Posted October 27, 2022 Share Posted October 27, 2022 On 10/25/2022 at 5:31 AM, Newbie said: Do you have evidence to support that? I am genuinely interested. In the UK at least, the most recent ONS figures relating to rape perpetrators do not include data relating to gender identity. They are broken down by biological sex, rather than by how the individuals identify. Not to hand, its based on my own research I did a few months back collating information from numerous sources as well as ONS figures. They don't break down via gender identity, but they do break down into smaller sub categories that do cover the LGBTQIA+ It was numerous hours of research, news articles, statistics and more. I didn't want to engage on the subject without having at least a half decent understanding of what was actually happening compared to what is claimed to be happening. In the last seven/eight years there have been a number of trans people convicted for sexual offences, one of which was in a toilet (if there were more toilet related I was unable at the time to find any). The total number if I remember, without digging it all out again, was around 14 confirmed cases at the time with a higher number of convictions due to re offending by the same individuals. While not super, it pales compared to the triple / quadruple figured numbers of cis male sexual offenders. You are right though, until they start recording via how people identify, it's difficult to say a definite on the subject. However, all evidence that I saw pointed to the current narrative being very wrong. Trust, if there was genuinely a serious nationwide issue in this way, I would be the first to condemn it, I hate sexual offenders and have seen the damage it can cause its victims. As I said, without going back through it all again I can't give you exact info. But, it is all out there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chie Posted October 27, 2022 Share Posted October 27, 2022 (edited) On 10/24/2022 at 7:22 PM, Newbie said: Yes I have read it. At least the Interim Report, which is the only one that has been published so far (at least as far as I am aware). I agree that it isn't anti trans vitriol, and I never suggested that it was. Contrary to what you say, that isn't what I think. It makes some very sensible suggestions. It does however illustrate that gender identity issues in children and adolescents are complex, and that there are pitfalls in the approach that was adopted by the Tavistock. It also gives an insight into how professionals working there who tried to raise concerns were treated. I raised it in the context of another post that seemed to give a very one sided view of the problems faced by young people with gender identity issues, and how they should be approached. I agree, I am all for Tavi closing and these new regional centres being opened. I do agree that a greater focus of care needs to be given for trans youth. Even if they are confident in who they are and are sure about what they want, having someone to talk to will help them better understand the path they are choosing to take and give them better support while undergoing any treatment. And, for those who are still questioning, it will give them time to explore their options and their identity before making a serious commitment. Edited October 27, 2022 by Chie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passing Time Posted October 27, 2022 Share Posted October 27, 2022 3 hours ago, Chie said: I agree, I am all for Tavi closing and these new regional centres being opened. I do agree that a greater focus of care needs to be given for trans youth. Even if they are confident in who they are and are sure about what they want, having someone to talk to will help them better understand the path they are choosing to take and give them better support while undergoing any treatment. And, for those who are still questioning, it will give them time to explore their options and their identity before making a serious commitment. Are you the female PK? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipskhaoo Posted October 29, 2022 Share Posted October 29, 2022 He/she/him/her/they/them.... mobdro 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Ship Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 On 10/27/2022 at 7:57 PM, Chie said: There is any amount of evidence if you watch her videos or live streams. It would be too much work to pull up every single video, live stream or interview of hers and go through each one and post them here. I have mentioned a few of them before in recent posts and in the last couple of months she has been making comments about eradicating trans people... If it isn't "...too much work..." for you*, could you put up some links demonstrating where she has actually made verifiable "... comments about eradicating trans people..." rather than simply you saying that she has? I'm honestly interested in reading them - assuming she has actually made such comments. * You don't need to "... pull up every single video, live stream or interview of hers and go through each one and post them here... ". I'd be happy to read a single verifiable quote where she supports "eradicating trans people", which seems to be what you are implying she has said. (Otherwise why link her by association with "comments about eradicating trans people"?) Can you do so? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinahand Posted January 12, 2023 Share Posted January 12, 2023 We'll written, if dripping with sarcasm, article documenting and discussing the consequences of New Scientist's attempt to not refer to women in its articles replacing them people with vaginas etc. https://thecritic.co.uk/sex-new-scientist-and-me/ 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted January 12, 2023 Share Posted January 12, 2023 1 hour ago, Chinahand said: We'll written, if dripping with sarcasm, article documenting and discussing the consequences of New Scientist's attempt to not refer to women in its articles replacing them people with vaginas etc. https://thecritic.co.uk/sex-new-scientist-and-me/ The problem is that the writer of the article confuses biological gamete determined sex with social construct gender. And ignores that someone of male gender identity but female biological sex may have a vagina and menstruate. It May sound clumsy, and perhaps we are still developing the correct inclusive terminology. That doesn’t make it any the less important or correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheldon Posted January 12, 2023 Share Posted January 12, 2023 1 hour ago, Chinahand said: We'll written, if dripping with sarcasm, article documenting and discussing the consequences of New Scientist's attempt to not refer to women in its articles replacing them people with vaginas etc. https://thecritic.co.uk/sex-new-scientist-and-me/ New Scientist has been a dumbed down repetitive organ (no pun intended) which caters to the lowest common intellectual denominator for quite some time now. Read any of their articles on quantum computing, for example, and you'll understand the true meaning of "condescending". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 More good news. UK blocks Scotland's/Sturgeon's fancy... https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jan/16/rishi-sunak-blocks-scotlands-gender-recognition-legislation 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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