Numbnuts Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 13 hours ago, AlanShimmin said: It would be good to 'compare notes'. I have a few things that I'm sure will come out soon. Heard today that there now going to 'plane' off the top few inches of pink concrete and replace with 'pink' tarmac. If thats even possible !?? Previous was told they are just removing it all and replacing with tarmac. Time will tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbnuts Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 13 hours ago, AlanShimmin said: It would be good to 'compare notes'. I have a few things that I'm sure will come out soon. Wonder if the fact there were no detailed plans when they started , hence the jumping around by workman in early days , will ever be made public. If you read the management meeting minutes its hinted but not openly made clear. The fact they have had to intrude onto the walkway due to major cockups on routing services should be a major factor in any investigation also. All linked to no detailed plans just concept plans . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptarmigan Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 All sorts of badness will have gone on to hide stuff in the budget, not deliberate wrong doing or fraud, but to try and escape public scrutiny and also from a lack of understanding of how these things work...budgets and big capital projects. I think they are in the sink costs fallacy stage now. They need to stop, get an independent professional project manager in, work out the most cost effective strategy to get it finished and work with the contractor. Take any current management and politicians away from it as 1) it’s not working and 2) they’ve admitted they’ve no idea of how much it’s going to cost to finish 3) they have an interest in lots of bad decisions never coming to light so it’s likely bad decisions are being made to try and ‘make it better’. it’s like the Edinburgh trams all over again! . 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbnuts Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 1 minute ago, ptarmigan said: All sorts of badness will have gone on to hide stuff in the budget, not deliberate wrong doing or fraud, but to try and escape public scrutiny and also from a lack of understanding of how these things work...budgets and big capital projects. I think they are in the sink costs fallacy stage now. They need to stop, get an independent professional project manager in, work out the most cost effective strategy to get it finished and work with the contractor. Take any current management and politicians away from it as 1) it’s not working and 2) they’ve admitted they’ve no idea of how much it’s going to cost to finish 3) they have an interest in lots of bad decisions never coming to light so it’s likely bad decisions are being made to try and ‘make it better’. it’s like the Edinburgh trams all over again! . Never a truer word ....Auldyn are into DOI for big sums apparently due to day work in early days and of course the ripping up of so much and redoing . Lots to do with spec being wrong . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 1 minute ago, ptarmigan said: All sorts of badness will have gone on to hide stuff in the budget, not deliberate wrong doing or fraud, but to try and escape public scrutiny and also from a lack of understanding of how these things work...budgets and big capital projects. I think they are in the sink costs fallacy stage now. They need to stop, get an independent professional project manager in, work out the most cost effective strategy to get it finished and work with the contractor. Take any current management and politicians away from it as 1) it’s not working and 2) they’ve admitted they’ve no idea of how much it’s going to cost to finish 3) they have an interest in lots of bad decisions never coming to light so it’s likely bad decisions are being made to try and ‘make it better’. it’s like the Edinburgh trams all over again! . Or Holyrood. Quote From the outset, the building and its construction have been controversial.[9] The choices of location, architect, design, and construction company were all criticised by politicians, the media and the Scottish public. Scheduled to open in 2001,[10] it did so in 2004, more than three years late with an estimated final cost of £414 million, many times higher than initial estimates of between £10m and £40m. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptarmigan Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 Starting a house build with concept plans...we’ve all seen how that goes on Grand Designs. If that’s true...I mean really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbnuts Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 2 minutes ago, ptarmigan said: Starting a house build with concept plans...we’ve all seen how that goes on Grand Designs. If that’s true...I mean really? Agreed mind blowing but source who was working there early days with services etc said that was totally what was happening . Go back into my prom minutes from Management meetings and you can see it mentioned by Auldyn when questioned about progress of works etc. Maybe have to go back to late 2019 but its clear to see and confirms what I was told from a solid source. It all makes interesting reading anyway if you haven't already looked through the minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finlo Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 3 hours ago, Numbnuts said: Agreed mind blowing but source who was working there early days with services etc said that was totally what was happening . Go back into my prom minutes from Management meetings and you can see it mentioned by Auldyn when questioned about progress of works etc. Maybe have to go back to late 2019 but its clear to see and confirms what I was told from a solid source. It all makes interesting reading anyway if you haven't already looked through the minutes. It was a shambles from the outset but I was shot down by Dilli for suggesting it should be done in bite sized chunks saying had to all be done at once so there would be no joints in cables and pipes etc! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Power Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 3 minutes ago, finlo said: It was a shambles from the outset but I was shot down by Dilli for suggesting it should be done in bite sized chunks saying had to all be done at once so there would be no joints in cables and pipes etc! I think you were right, the cabling and pipework is still being done in bite size chunks anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finlo Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 1 minute ago, Max Power said: I think you were right, the cabling and pipework is still being done in bite size chunks anyway. Exactly, there will be joints at every property to service it! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbnuts Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 (edited) 42 minutes ago, finlo said: Exactly, there will be joints at every property to service it! Just take a look outside T shirt shops on Queens prom and you can see the new Cable running through and with all the tails coming of most still to be connected into properties.. Properties still being supplied from old supply . When I last looked on Thursday the lads were working on the tails with approx 20 plus to be made off . Edited May 8, 2021 by Numbnuts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Onchan Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 1 hour ago, finlo said: It was a shambles from the outset but I was shot down by Dilli for suggesting it should be done in bite sized chunks saying had to all be done at once so there would be no joints in cables and pipes etc! If that was the case why was there not one single trench all the way along the prom? It's bollox. A section at a time was the way to go. You then have something to show for the work that's been done. What we have now is an wholly incomplete project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finlo Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 2 minutes ago, Andy Onchan said: If that was the case why was there not one single trench all the way along the prom? It's bollox. A section at a time was the way to go. You then have something to show for the work that's been done. What we have now is an wholly incomplete project. Also imagine how much could have been saved on cone and Heras fencing hire! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanShimmin Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 The elephant in the room is the cracked concrete. DOI have been told by two separate sources, with expertise in this area and knowledge of the problems, that it will all have to come up and either be renewed or preferably replaced with tarmac. With no rubber encasement/insulation around the tram tracks it means that every time there is warm weather the concrete is going to crack again and again. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbnuts Posted May 8, 2021 Share Posted May 8, 2021 (edited) Alan , posted in January 2020 after Mr Baker stated that the cracks were not bad ! The Promenade Cracks and Tim Baker Well after listening to Mr Baker, who incidentally comes across as very pleasant and affable , last week waxing lyrically on Manx Radio and stating clearly the DOI stand .The promenade cracking apparently isn't that bad and there's not that many cracks and it's been monitored etc Well Mr Baker I'm sorry but I disagree totally with this stand and rhetoric . It's clearly very bad and to state otherwise is a insult to the Isle of Man public. Whether born here or people who've come to settle here they all deserve honesty from our representatives .So this morning I took a walk along the Prom and the infamous red concrete . My findings were quite mind blowing and are restricted to a area approximately of 350 m and are taken from entrance to car park at Great Western and TT shirts shop on Queens prom. Center wide red concrete between the both pairs of rails .... 131 cracks approx Landside only small fringe red concrete (approx 50cm ) .....241 cracks approx So it's not a few cracks as indicated and it's getting worse as I'd had a look at this area back before Xmas and it wasn't this bad . Thoughts anyone ?? 372 cracks in approx 350m I reitrate this is approx 350 m only and the count about 18 months ago . Edited May 8, 2021 by Numbnuts 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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