Rog Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 I would dearly love to see a Conservative victory I'm fear from convinced such will be he case. Quite apart from the BREXIT divide Labour have played a very clever campaign by targeting marginal seats and immigrant communities and colonies. Use of the anti-Semitic card is hugely attractive there and also amongst many knuckle dragging British.The Conservative campaign has dropped a huge bollock by trying to outspent the Labour spending proposals because they immediately prompt the question if hey can see he need and have the money why was nothing done before. I'm not going to rant on but to e what this highlights is how very much we should move from the FTP to some form of PR. My prediction for this election? A Lib/Lab coalition though I continue hoping for a Conservative government.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 The Lib-Dems know that the biggest voter turn-off is Corbyn as PM. Hence the way they are banging on and on that there will be no coalition with Labour. IMHO Corbyn is seen as so toxic the tories will win easily. Add McCluskey to the mix and people like Tom Watson know it's a lost cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lagman Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 3 hours ago, Rog said: I would dearly love to see a Conservative victory I'm fear from convinced such will be he case. Quite apart from the BREXIT divide Labour have played a very clever campaign by targeting marginal seats and immigrant communities and colonies. Use of the anti-Semitic card is hugely attractive there and also amongst many knuckle dragging British.The Conservative campaign has dropped a huge bollock by trying to outspent the Labour spending proposals because they immediately prompt the question if hey can see he need and have the money why was nothing done before. I'm not going to rant on but to e what this highlights is how very much we should move from the FTP to some form of PR. My prediction for this election? A Lib/Lab coalition though I continue hoping for a Conservative government.. Only if it's rigged will that coalition win now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 1 hour ago, P.K. said: The Lib-Dems know that the biggest voter turn-off is Corbyn as PM. Hence the way they are banging on and on that there will be no coalition with Labour. IMHO Corbyn is seen as so toxic the tories will win easily. Add McCluskey to the mix and people like Tom Watson know it's a lost cause. I have seen a few elections but this is the oddest yet. Methinks tis really a referendum masquerading as an election. I would not be surprised if Boris loses his seat. Interesting problem for Queen if she asks Boris to be PM and he can only do it by being made a peer. Lord Salisbury was PM in the Lords and IOM Lt Gov appointed Don Gelling as CM in the LegCo. Many years since I did this sort of thing at school but I think it is still possible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 1 hour ago, Barrie Stevens said: I have seen a few elections but this is the oddest yet. Methinks tis really a referendum masquerading as an election. I would not be surprised if Boris loses his seat. Interesting problem for Queen if she asks Boris to be PM and he can only do it by being made a peer. Lord Salisbury was PM in the Lords and IOM Lt Gov appointed Don Gelling as CM in the LegCo. Many years since I did this sort of thing at school but I think it is still possible You can’t be PM and in the Lords. Last time it happened was Douglas-Home. Tory party selected him, he resigned his Lords seat, and an obliging Tory MP applied for the Chiltern Hundreds, or conveniently died, Home stood and he was elected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 11 minutes ago, John Wright said: You can’t be PM and in the Lords. Last time it happened was Douglas-Home. Tory party selected him, he resigned his Lords seat, and an obliging Tory MP applied for the Chiltern Hundreds, or conveniently died, Home stood and he was elected. Yes indeed I recall that Home and Tony Wedgwood Benn (Viscount Stansgate) both renounced peerages not their seats as such. But today some constitutional folk are raising the issue of a PM in the Lords..I will have to think back. I seem to recall it was not so much you cannot be PM in the Lords more like you cannot sit in the Commons as a Lord and be PM..Both men wanted to be in the Commons. In theory a PM can be a Lord I believe this is so. In other words the situation is reversed you can be a life peer say and be PM but it is a long shot. I last did this stuff for A level in 1969 but I think in theory it is possible to be a PM in the Lords. The PM is the personal creature of the sovereign and nothing to do with being elected to the Commons. Long time ago but one of them was in the Commons but had to give it up when he inherited the title. Not sure about Home and have not researched it. I and others met Alec Douglas Home as he was on a school trip to Parliament about 1964.I must look into it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 28 minutes ago, John Wright said: You can’t be PM and in the Lords. Last time it happened was Douglas-Home. Tory party selected him, he resigned his Lords seat, and an obliging Tory MP applied for the Chiltern Hundreds, or conveniently died, Home stood and he was elected. They also have government ministers in the Lords...At one time the Minister of State for the Isle of Man etc was in the Lords... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 2 minutes ago, Barrie Stevens said: They also have government ministers in the Lords...At one time the Minister of State for the Isle of Man etc was in the Lords... https://www.quora.com/How-could-a-lord-become-a-prime-minister-Could-he-be-elected It seems possible in theory but a long shot these days... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 A lot pertaining to the House of Lords changed in Blair's time. Have a look at that before dusting off your ancient A-levels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 32 minutes ago, Barrie Stevens said: Yes indeed I recall that Home and Tony Wedgwood Benn (Viscount Stansgate) both renounced peerages not their seats as such. But today some constitutional folk are raising the issue of a PM in the Lords..I will have to think back. I seem to recall it was not so much you cannot be PM in the Lords more like you cannot sit in the Commons as a Lord and be PM..Both men wanted to be in the Commons. In theory a PM can be a Lord I believe this is so. In other words the situation is reversed you can be a life peer say and be PM but it is a long shot. I last did this stuff for A level in 1969 but I think in theory it is possible to be a PM in the Lords. The PM is the personal creature of the sovereign and nothing to do with being elected to the Commons. Long time ago but one of them was in the Commons but had to give it up when he inherited the title. Not sure about Home and have not researched it. I and others met Alec Douglas Home as he was on a school trip to Parliament about 1964.I must look into it... It was Tony Benn in the Commons and he had to leave when he inherited the title Viscount Stansgate. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tony_Benn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 1 hour ago, John Wright said: You can’t be PM and in the Lords. Last time it happened was Douglas-Home. Tory party selected him, he resigned his Lords seat, and an obliging Tory MP applied for the Chiltern Hundreds, or conveniently died, Home stood and he was elected. Lord Hume of the Hirstle was the last PM in the House of Lords but briefly. He renounced the title using the then new legislation of 1963 and stood for election to the Commons as Sir Alec Douglas Home. Thus he was PM in both houses. It was not OK in the 1960s to have a PM in the Lords. But I think still possible in theory but might cause a lot of trouble... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alec_Douglas-Home Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 31 minutes ago, Barrie Stevens said: https://www.quora.com/How-could-a-lord-become-a-prime-minister-Could-he-be-elected It seems possible in theory but a long shot these days... But if Boris loses his Commons seat no one is going to try persuade Liz to give him a peerage and then allow him to put an administration so he can go to the Palace and kiss hands. Home is proof, if ever it were needed, that the constitutional convention now is that a PM cannot sit in the Lords. The one before that was Churchill/Halifax in 1940. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 4 minutes ago, John Wright said: But if Boris loses his Commons seat no one is going to try persuade Liz to give him a peerage and then allow him to put an administration so he can go to the Palace and kiss hands. Home is proof, if ever it were needed, that the constitutional convention now is that a PM cannot sit in the Lords. The one before that was Churchill/Halifax in 1940. Indeed. But the subject has been raised. And we live in interesting times viz a viz Brexit. Never count your eggs till they be in the pudding...And never say never. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 7 minutes ago, John Wright said: But if Boris loses his Commons seat no one is going to try persuade Liz to give him a peerage and then allow him to put an administration so he can go to the Palace and kiss hands. Home is proof, if ever it were needed, that the constitutional convention now is that a PM cannot sit in the Lords. The one before that was Churchill/Halifax in 1940. Don Gelling was CM and appointed and LegCo is like the Lords constitutionally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrie Stevens Posted November 15, 2019 Share Posted November 15, 2019 22 minutes ago, woolley said: A lot pertaining to the House of Lords changed in Blair's time. Have a look at that before dusting off your ancient A-levels. I agree but for some reason these principles seem to survive and hold water in an unwritten constitution. And I do listen to dusty Radio 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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