Numbnuts Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Annoymouse said: My guess is he’s a resident, certainly strikes me as a stereotypical ‘When I’ And looking for his moment of glory . Think this might backfire on him though . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 minute ago, Numbnuts said: And looking for his moment of glory . Think this might backfire on him though . He looks to be a proper conspiracy theory purveyor - on numerous issues. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apple Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 5 hours ago, Gladys said: There is a whole industry around standards, setting them, implementing process to meet them, accreditation and audit. Wouldn't be any for Governments by any chance...? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manx Yeller Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 I have been thinking about the practical use of genomics and have come up with 2 scenarios where I believe it would help. In scenario 1, John tests positive and track n trace get to work. They can't find a link with anyone who has tested positive before so looks like we have an unexplained community case. In fairness to the tnt team, they are trying to find a needle in numerous haystacks. When genomics takes over, they show that this case has to be linked to a certain previous case. This jogs John's memory or even just allows tnt team to concentrate all their effort on one haystack and we are now able to link it to a previous case, so no need to extend lockdown. Scenario 2, John again tests positive but says he was in Tesco at one of the times on the low risk list. Everyone is happy and it's marked down as a known community case. Genomics could be used to (hopefully) confirm this is the case. Alternatively genomics could actually show that Tesco wasn't the link, and that this time John is actually an unknown community case, meaning lockdown is potentially extended this time but hopefully also meaning that in 2 weeks time, we're not in a new lockdown... Do they seem right? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 47 minutes ago, Manx Yeller said: I have been thinking about the practical use of genomics and have come up with 2 scenarios where I believe it would help. In scenario 1, John tests positive and track n trace get to work. They can't find a link with anyone who has tested positive before so looks like we have an unexplained community case. In fairness to the tnt team, they are trying to find a needle in numerous haystacks. When genomics takes over, they show that this case has to be linked to a certain previous case. This jogs John's memory or even just allows tnt team to concentrate all their effort on one haystack and we are now able to link it to a previous case, so no need to extend lockdown. Scenario 2, John again tests positive but says he was in Tesco at one of the times on the low risk list. Everyone is happy and it's marked down as a known community case. Genomics could be used to (hopefully) confirm this is the case. Alternatively genomics could actually show that Tesco wasn't the link, and that this time John is actually an unknown community case, meaning lockdown is potentially extended this time but hopefully also meaning that in 2 weeks time, we're not in a new lockdown... Do they seem right? They’re both the same. They’re both community transmission. It’s not where John got it from, it’s to whom he might have passed it to, between infection and testing, that the lockdown is designed to stop further passing on from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Ashie has been caught suggesting we may move from manufacturers recommended 21/28 day interval between Covid vaccine doses and follow the UK 12 week interval. Today we will hit 5% population receiving first dose. UK about 8% and Israel 25%. Israel is using the 12 week interval. But they’re finding that the effectiveness is way below the 52% pfizer figure for single dose effectiveness. And Israel has seen its highest level of new cases in the pandemic so far, 8,000 per day. Equivalent to 64,000 in UK terms. Despite whatever community immunity there is and 25% vaccination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manx Yeller Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 10 minutes ago, John Wright said: They’re both the same. They’re both community transmission. It’s not where John got it from, it’s to whom he might have passed it to, between infection and testing, that the lockdown is designed to stop further passing on from. Agreed, I'm using the government policy on "explained" and "unexplained" community cases which is obviously what's going to get us out of this lockdown. (Although I note that I used known and unknown in my post rather than explained and unexplained 🤦) Just trying to see if these are practical example of how genomics could be used to help track and trace and either stop lockdown being extended when it doesn't need to be by helping to find the link to move a case from unexplained to explained, or on the other hand extend lockdown if it actually needed to be by disproving a link when otherwise we'd be out of lockdown with potential cases still floating around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beelzebub3 Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 18 hours ago, doc.fixit said: ....and the radio mast at the point and the, marinas', and the air ships and the .....??? The replica Bounty, Jurby racetrack and Orry the sealion. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 7 minutes ago, Roxanne said: God, it wasn't Binlid was it? Mark Windows “Windows on the World” Mr Houston seems to contribute. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2bees Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Honest to goodness, it was bad enough when Dr Glover was publicly upset about her treatment but now our CM is $&%#*{^ her in public, this is a complete mess. It wouldn’t be so bad if it wasn’t so bloody serious with global implications - come on the government, sort it out! I used signs because I couldn’t find any words bad enough to describe Mr Quayle’s latest “words of wisdom” re “gene stuff”. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 55 minutes ago, Manx Yeller said: Agreed, I'm using the government policy on "explained" and "unexplained" community cases which is obviously what's going to get us out of this lockdown. (Although I note that I used known and unknown in my post rather than explained and unexplained 🤦) Just trying to see if these are practical example of how genomics could be used to help track and trace and either stop lockdown being extended when it doesn't need to be by helping to find the link to move a case from unexplained to explained, or on the other hand extend lockdown if it actually needed to be by disproving a link when otherwise we'd be out of lockdown with potential cases still floating around. It could be used. It cant 'prove' a link as the same strain could come by different routes. However it would be a forensic tool that could help to trace infection routes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 1 hour ago, John Wright said: Ashie has been caught suggesting we may move from manufacturers recommended 21/28 day interval between Covid vaccine doses and follow the UK 12 week interval. Today we will hit 5% population receiving first dose. UK about 8% and Israel 25%. Israel is using the 12 week interval. But they’re finding that the effectiveness is way below the 52% pfizer figure for single dose effectiveness. And Israel has seen its highest level of new cases in the pandemic so far, 8,000 per day. Equivalent to 64,000 in UK terms. Despite whatever community immunity there is and 25% vaccination. It would be crazy for the IOm to go for the 12 week programme at the moment. It's right for the UK as infections are rampant and using the 80:20 principle protect as many as you can even if it's not 100% For us, seems we have no infections , so staying to the best and recommended programme is obviously the favoured option. I am going on like a broken record though when I say again that we should not be so dogmatic about the exact 3 weeks and be saving stocks. It's not the end of the world if 3 weeks becomes 4 for some people. If you introduce strict timescales into any programme (be it vaccination or building things) you run the risk of losing efficiency and speed. Common sense and flexibility should be applied. Just my view 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 13 hours ago, alpha-acid said: ISO is just meaningless paperwork. If you are a Lab you are given samples to analyse from the Govt Chemist (UK) and send your results back, they then analyse said results, then send them back to you with how you did to compare with other Labs, in the Brewing Lab case was 375 worldwide. This is Peer analysis means much more than any ISO paper can ever Surely peer analysis would be part of your quality system and therefore part of your iso certification. They are not mutually exclusive. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoTail Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 A worry about our long term plan to open the borders. Using very rough figures assume a population of 90,000 and rought 1/3 over 60, 1/3 20-59 and 1/3 under 20. If we assume 10% of over 60s refuse vaccination (nutters) and same for the middle group then at end 9f May there would be 36,000 over 50s exposed to infection in the population 3,000 over 60. There are only 20 odd beds in Nobles to cope, so we would rapidly get overwhelmed. By end September when the whole population has been eligible for vaccination there would still be around 9,000 who refused. We need a good plan to beef up the hospital or we will never open the borders based on current thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Just now, NoTail said: A worry about our long term plan to open the borders. Using very rough figures assume a population of 90,000 and rought 1/3 over 60, 1/3 20-59 and 1/3 under 20. If we assume 10% of over 60s refuse vaccination (nutters) and same for the middle group then at end 9f May there would be 36,000 over 50s exposed to infection in the population 3,000 over 60. There are only 20 odd beds in Nobles to cope, so we would rapidly get overwhelmed. By end September when the whole population has been eligible for vaccination there would still be around 9,000 who refused. We need a good plan to beef up the hospital or we will never open the borders based on current thinking. It's possible but do you think its realistic that 10% will refuse. I believe it's less than 1% refusing in the UK at the moment. Maybe good old manx stubbornness might push that number up but cant see 10%. Most people are keen to get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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