IOM Covid removing restrictions

[Happier diner]

6 hours ago, AcousticallyChallenged said:

No, but if you get your window smashed, you also have a compulsion to go round throwing your own bricks through other people’s windows. But, you don’t know you’ve had a brick through your window for anything between 2 and 14 days. 
 

When you’ve had that brick through your window, you get a compulsion to start throwing bricks through other people’s windows, even before you’ve found the brick through yours. Just an overwhelming urge that overtakes you. You might never know you’ve had a brick through your window. 
 

So, you have an epidemic of brick throwing. You want to find out who started throwing the bricks, why they started throwing the bricks, and whose windows they threw them at. 
 

What you don’t know, is whether A remembers everyone whose windows they threw bricks at, nor without going to look, how many windows were broken. 
 

But, Mrs Jones suddenly finds that she’s being overtaken by this brick throwing urge. She hasn’t had any bricks thrown at her windows that she knows of, but, it turns out, she has the compulsion too. 
 

Now, finding out quickly who threw the brick at her, means you know whether there are any unknown brick throwers, or it turns out Mrs Jones bumped into your original brick thrower in the pub. 
 

Of course, the sooner you unmask any unidentified brick throwers, the quicker we can go back to normal and let people go out and about, rather than staying home to deter brick throwers. 

No idea what you are talking about, but I'll use a different analogy next time.

The only point I note is that you use the word quickly. Something genomic testing is not. There are two speeds.

Slow with an on island lab or

Even slower with sending samples to liverpool.

Neither are any use with tracing infection routes as they are both too slow.

[TheTeapot]

10 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

 

Neither are any use with tracing infection routes as they are both too slow.

Interesting you say this at the same time as the contact tracing team are issuing alerts about places people may have been a week ago.

You're never ever going to see the point. It has to be on purpose. We all know what the fuckwits problem is, he hates women. What's yours?

Edited February 20, 2021 by TheTeapot

[AcousticallyChallenged]

2 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

No idea what you are talking about, but I'll use a different analogy next time.

The only point I note is that you use the word quickly. Something genomic testing is not. There are two speeds.

Slow with an on island lab or

Even slower with sending samples to liverpool.

Neither are any use with tracing infection routes as they are both too slow.

 

The virus has an incubation period before people are infectious. This is anything from 2-14 days. Genomics with a full report can be done on island in 36 hours. Note, that that's suddenly within the window.

Even with just contact tracing, we've identified people who have tested negative, who then went on to test positive. It's not unreasonable to assume that you aren't as infectious until testing positive.

Testing and contact tracing put us ahead where we have clear chains of transmission. Genomics fills in the gaps in the chains where contact tracing can't. People forget, or misremember. The RNA doesn't.

If you can identify those chains, then you can avoid falling into the criteria of a full lockdown. As our MHKs so proudly tell us, we don't lock down until there's unknown community spread.

[AcousticallyChallenged]

1 new case today in a close contact of the existing cluster.

[Roger Mexico]

6 hours ago, Happier diner said:

It was metaphorical. I thought you would have spotted that.

Well obviously I did.  I was merely pointing out the irony of using a metaphor which actually undermined the case you were trying to make against using genomics when you looked at the reality of trying get information off a brick.  Fingerprints are hard at best (depending on the nature of the surface), DNA much easier and has been used to solve important cases.  Others had already pointed out the problems with the metaphor itself.

[Barlow]

1 hour ago, Banker said:

Imagine if what occurred in Jersey had happened here, calls for permanent lockdown, execution etc😀

https://www.channel103.com/news/jersey-news/small-covid-outbreak-caused-by-household-mixing/

I'm not sure about the permanent lockdown but something approaching execution would seem about right.

1 hour ago, monasqueen said:

Where are all those people who were crowing about how brilliant Jersey's Covid technique was?

They're still posting to the thread, which is a good thing because they remind everyone of some of the ridiculous views that are out there and provide the opportunity for others to post more sensible opinions on Covid-19.

Edited February 20, 2021 by Barlow

[Roger Mexico]

8 minutes ago, Barlow said:

I'm not sure about the permanent lockdown but something approaching execution would seem about right.

But the trouble with Jersey is that they seem to be about to make exactly the same mistakes all over again.  They're still banning mixing of households, but according to that piece are starting up 'hospitality' in a few days time.  So households can mix, providing they are paying for it.

If there is anything that has marked the mishandling of Covid outbreaks more than anything else, it's the belief that the presence of money will somehow drive off the virus.

[Banker]

Seems a lot of exemptions issued for n January , from Tynwald questions on gef

Compassionate and Contractual exemptions

Between January 1 and 31 a total of 351 compassionate exemptions and 178 contractual exemptions were approved for travel.

During this time, 1407 calls were made and 1709 house visits were carried out in person. This figure does include returning Isle of Man residents.

 

Also key workers for 2 months which includes Xmas when assume not many travel 

 

Key Workers

From December 1 to January 31, 185 key worker exemptions were granted between five gov departments. Onchan MHK 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 20, 2021 by Banker

[Barlow]

21 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said:

If there is anything that has marked the mishandling of Covid outbreaks more than anything else, it's the belief that the presence of money will somehow drive off the virus.

Eat Out To Help *withdrwn* was unbelievable.

 

[Happier diner]

57 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said:

Well obviously I did.  I was merely pointing out the irony of using a metaphor which actually undermined the case you were trying to make against using genomics when you looked at the reality of trying get information off a brick.  Fingerprints are hard at best (depending on the nature of the surface), DNA much easier and has been used to solve important cases.  Others had already pointed out the problems with the metaphor itself.

I concurred in an earlier thread that it was a poor analogy. 

[Happier diner]

1 hour ago, TheTeapot said:

Interesting you say this at the same time as the contact tracing team are issuing alerts about places people may have been a week ago.

You're never ever going to see the point. It has to be on purpose. We all know what the fuckwits problem is, he hates women. What's yours?

Like I keep saying, track and trace is on result of a positive test result and identifying close contacts. Making them isolate and testing them. Testing for covid 19. No one gives a xxxx what variant it is at that stage because is doesnt matter what it is. 

The genomic testing tells you the variant, which is important information. But it is nothing to do with track and trace as the test result come back too late.

You must always bear in mind that there is a limited number of variants. So you cannot say (unlike with fingerprinting) that there is a definite link just because the genetic code is the same. Making that assumption and using that information could actually be misleading when tracing cases.

As hennyetty said, we use  European disease protocol of infection control.  It does not specify the need for genetic sequencing. As gar as I know there are any jurisdictions using it for this purpose.

It is clear that there are benefits and many jurisdictions are using it to find out more about infection routes and to learn about the travel of different strains. We are too small to see any benefit of that and also we are clearly very good at nailing the infection routes through vigorous test and trace. 

So no I am never going to see your point because i don't agree with it.

[TheTeapot]

That post is full of shit.

What you have just displayed there is that you don't understand it.

There are billions of variants. have a look at nextstrain.org, you may need a decent computer to get it to load now there is that much info on there. 

Your refusal to grasp the point is pathetic.

[The Old Git]

2 hours ago, monasqueen said:

Where are all those people who were crowing about how brilliant Jersey's Covid technique was?

And what happened to "the Great Jersey Public"?

They got bored?

[TerryFuchwit]

1 hour ago, TheTeapot said:

Interesting you say this at the same time as the contact tracing team are issuing alerts about places people may have been a week ago.

You're never ever going to see the point. It has to be on purpose. We all know what the fuckwits problem is, he hates women. What's yours?

You need to let it go. Move on. 

It doesn't make any difference to the process.  

[Happier diner]

11 minutes ago, TheTeapot said:

That post is full of shit.

What you have just displayed there is that you don't understand it.

There are billions of variants. have a look at nextstrain.org, you may need a decent computer to get it to load now there is that much info on there. 

Your refusal to grasp the point is pathetic.

I'll replace the word variant with strain. 

Give me one example of how genomic testing with a result in 3 days instead of 5 would have improved an outcome. Also tell me whT qualifications you have to make us follow your recommendations rather than those who are professionally qualified and employed to make decisions