IOM Covid removing restrictions

[P.K.]

8 minutes ago, Golfer said:

I don't think you can compare countries with 10,000s of cases to iom which has 39 active cases of which 18 outside hospital.

we need economy going and shops etc open 

You can compare them but that's not the point.

It's very obvious that relaxing the lockdown comes with an element of risk.

With 20% of voters residents aged 65 and over I agree with the government and their caution. Putting lives over restarting the economy is the right approach. In fact the only approach. Especially after taking into account the Fuckwit Factor of the general public. After all, the government of the day have a duty of care to ALL of their citizens.

 (Just going to lie down in a darkened room for a moment or so to recover my composure...)

[TheTeapot]

21 minutes ago, Golfer said:

I don't think you can compare countries with 10,000s of cases to iom which has 39 active cases of which 18 outside hospital.

we need economy going and shops etc open 

I'm not comparing. I'm trying to remind people who seem to have forgotten that this virus is extremely contagious, and that even countries who seem to have it under control are still struggling to do so completely. 

[Lost Login]

9 minutes ago, Golfer said:

I don't think you can compare countries with 10,000s of cases to iom which has 39 active cases of which 18 outside hospital.

we need economy going and shops etc open 

I am struggling to understand why with the minimal number of cases we have and it seems none of them are from people working outside health care, shopping, socialising to the extent it is allowed etc we are not opening up. Yes require social distancing, limit numbers in shops, size of gatherings for a few weeks just in case there is a spike but lets get back to normal including getting kids back at school.

I see and hear of more and more people breaking the current rules, which is infuriating for those of us who are trying not to. People are going around to friends and neighbours to chat whilst social distancing, many of those in the construction trade are not social distancing either whilst at work or travelling to work etc.

If we don't make the changes more and more will just break the rules, if we do many will continue to social distance and self isolate so I really think that it is time we should get back to normal unless IoM Govt or the clinicians believe that Covid 19 is still in the general community, not the community as Govt define, and that they could not cope.    

[The Dog's Dangly Bits]

2 minutes ago, Lost Login said:

I am struggling to understand why with the minimal number of cases we have and it seems none of them are from people working outside health care, shopping, socialising to the extent it is allowed etc we are not opening up. Yes require social distancing, limit numbers in shops, size of gatherings for a few weeks just in case there is a spike but lets get back to normal including getting kids back at school.

I see and hear of more and more people breaking the current rules, which is infuriating for those of us who are trying not to. People are going around to friends and neighbours to chat whilst social distancing, many of those in the construction trade are not social distancing either whilst at work or travelling to work etc.

If we don't make the changes more and more will just break the rules, if we do many will continue to social distance and self isolate so I really think that it is time we should get back to normal unless IoM Govt or the clinicians believe that Covid 19 is still in the general community, not the community as Govt define, and that they could not cope.    

Of course we should move forward on opening things.  To a degree the government are because they know each step taken is abused so it is kind of a window into the next step anyway.

Schools are an issue.  Purely because a few teachers sre refusing to entertain going back before September.  

[Golfer]

1 minute ago, The Dog's Dangly Bits said:

Of course we should move forward on opening things.  To a degree the government are because they know each step taken is abused so it is kind of a window into the next step anyway.

Schools are an issue.  Purely because a few teachers sre refusing to entertain going back before September.  

How can jersey get shops, bars open with similar levels of cases & not us?

if teachers aren't teaching they shouldn't be getting full pay,furlough them plus the ancillary staff like secretaries, dinner ladies etc until needed.

 

[P.K.]

Antibody tests create picture of Covid-19 in Jersey   

The Minister for Health and Social Services has said antibody test results from a survey of randomly selected Islanders will be invaluable in shaping how Jersey responds to the Covid-19 outbreak.

Data published by Statistics Jersey today shows that there have been an estimated 3,300 cases of Covid-19 in Jersey.

http://www.gov.je/News/2020/Pages/AntibodyTesting.aspx

[Lost Login]

Just now, TheTeapot said:

I'm not comparing. I'm trying to remind people who seem to have forgotten that this virus is extremely contagious, and that even countries who seem to have it under control are still struggling to do so completely. 

I would not describe it as extremely contagious. It is contagious but I believe that one person is general expected to infect 2 or 3 others without any precautions being put in place. Yes more contagious than flu generally is but you are not likely to catch it passing within a foot or so of a person with it unless they sneeze or cough over you. You will not catch it just from touching somebody or they touch you and even if they have coughed and sneezed over themselves or something you touch provided you practice good hygiene and don't touch your eyes. mouth etc you are again unlikely to catch.

As I have said before I know several people who have caught Covid 19 or live with people who have it and I don't think in any case that it has passed on within the household. Good hygiene and self isolating if you suspect you may have with social distancing are very effective.  

We cannot dismiss it and we need to have proper precautions but some of the videos there where shown on line with one person infecting 10 people and they each infecting 10 people where pretty misleading as where those that gave the impression that just by touching somebody else with it the infection would spread.  

[TheTeapot]

3 minutes ago, Lost Login said:

I would not describe it as extremely contagious. It is contagious but I believe that one person is general expected to infect 2 or 3 others without any precautions being put in place. Yes more contagious than flu generally is but you are not likely to catch it passing within a foot or so of a person with it unless they sneeze or cough over you. You will not catch it just from touching somebody or they touch you and even if they have coughed and sneezed over themselves or something you touch provided you practice good hygiene and don't touch your eyes. mouth etc you are again unlikely to catch.

Not being a scientist I don't really know how contagious it is, but if you look at the news from South Korea you can get something of an idea. Seeing as they had mostly got it under control with their track, trace, quarantine approach you can say they've got a pretty good idea of how things develop, and they reckon that one guy infected 15 others in a few hours on a night out. Sounds pretty contagious to me.

[The Dog's Dangly Bits]

Tonight's press conference by BJ will be interesting. 

[Lost Login]

21 minutes ago, P.K. said:

Putting lives over restarting the economy is the right approach. In fact the only approach.

But it is not as simple as that in the real world. You may be able to stop every death from Covid 19 in the IoM but in doing so it may result in more deaths from other things.

If saving lives is the only priority and especially when compared to economic factors there would be no TT/MGP, speed limits might be kept at 40mph or reduced further. We would have our borders permanently closed and restrictions in place to stop Flu getting to the IoM every year. In many activities there are risks but we do not stop those. I am not trying to be glib about the deaths arising from Covid 19 just trying to point out that insisting that we should take all steps to ensure there will be no deaths from Covid 19 is slightly perverse when we do not insist on the same in other arears of live.

[Lost Login]

3 minutes ago, TheTeapot said:

Not being a scientist I don't really know how contagious it is, but if you look at the news from South Korea you can get something of an idea. Seeing as they had mostly got it under control with their track, trace, quarantine approach you can say they've got a pretty good idea of how things develop, and they reckon that one guy infected 15 others in a few hours on a night out. Sounds pretty contagious to me.

There are "super spreaders" and I am not saying it is not contagious just that one person infecting loads is not the norm but which some are appear to be suggesting is the case. I am not saying we should all be allowed to go back into a crowded bar etc but that if we are sensible we should be able to return to a more normal way of life. The idiots will be idiots whatever, those who are sensible will be sensible.   

[Out of the blue]

20 minutes ago, Lost Login said:

But it is not as simple as that in the real world. You may be able to stop every death from Covid 19 in the IoM but in doing so it may result in more deaths from other things.

If saving lives is the only priority and especially when compared to economic factors there would be no TT/MGP, speed limits might be kept at 40mph or reduced further. We would have our borders permanently closed and restrictions in place to stop Flu getting to the IoM every year. In many activities there are risks but we do not stop those. I am not trying to be glib about the deaths arising from Covid 19 just trying to point out that insisting that we should take all steps to ensure there will be no deaths from Covid 19 is slightly perverse when we do not insist on the same in other arears of live.

People have been scared to death and now the unions are flexing their muscles. The result will be inertia and dithering. 

Edited May 10, 2020 by Out of the blue

[Southfork]

18 minutes ago, Lost Login said:

If saving lives is the only priority and especially when compared to economic factors there would be no TT/MGP, speed limits might be kept at 40mph or reduced further.

Brilliant point well made. More people will have died in the TT and MGP than will ever died of Covid on the IOM and that’s entirely fine and sponsored by government. It’s time to open up the economy before it’s too late. We’re going to be living with Covid for a while. It isn’t just going to go away if we stay in our houses and it’s clear most cases so far have been spread by key workers so maybe they should pay attention to their own advice on social distancing and general protection measures a bit more. 

[WTF]

3 minutes ago, Southfork said:

Brilliant point well made. More people will have died in the TT and MGP than will ever died of Covid on the IOM and that’s entirely fine and sponsored by government. It’s time to open up the economy before it’s too late. We’re going to be living with Covid for a while. It isn’t just going to go away if we stay in our houses and it’s clear most cases so far have been spread by key workers so maybe they should pay attention to their own advice on social distancing and general protection measures a bit more. 

i'm sure if we had had covid for over 100 years it would have killed more than the TT,  in fact, i don't ever remember a TT with more than 20 deaths,  i'm struggling to find a TT with double figures so comparing the 2 things is stupid but i guess that's just you.

[Out of the blue]

I read a couple of articles yesterday, one about how SD was going to change pubs and bars. In one bar that was going to effectively mean they could have ten people drinking inside instead on one hundred. Another article was describing how the 20-35yr age group were breaking lockdown and it was pushing for the young to be allowed out. I have been reading a lot about he new normal and how things will change. I do not buy it at all for practical as well as economic reasons. My prediction, in a few months we will have reverted to type, other than the elderly and those with conditions, I just cannot see people tolerating the new normal for long, certainly not once people start getting back to work, shopping and socializing again. I certainly cannot see people queuing outside in our great Manx winter. I may be wrong...