IOM Covid removing restrictions

[oooohtony]

18 minutes ago, AcousticallyChallenged said:

First off, it's not about the current death rate, or hospitalisation. It's about how those are changing week on week as things happen. That chart paints a much less whimsical picture. You are familiar with exponential growth right?

The best spin they can put on it so far is that we have exponential case growth whilst hospitalisation is following a more linear trend. The other thing is, the positivity has been creeping up to over 5%, which is where the WHO say you shouldn't even consider lifting any further restrictions. It's a sign you're dropping the ball, which the tories have done a number of times.

Never mind that it's not just the kids it is ripping through, it's in the older age groups in places like Durham.

 

So COVID is definitely cutting about a bit, what does that actually mean for us?

Well, 2% of the population have post-COVID complications, or long COVID as you may want to call it. https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/conditionsanddiseases/bulletins/prevalenceofongoingsymptomsfollowingcoronaviruscovid19infectionintheuk/1july2021

An article in the BMJ says:

You can find it here: https://adc.bmj.com/content/early/2021/05/27/archdischild-2021-321882

Fundamentally, what is now taking place is a Tory-led medical experiment in children and young adults. We simply don't know how much damage it will do to that age group left unchecked.

Never mind that, you'll have a large unvaccinated reservoir of virus to circulate, with parents/grandparents/adults around who are vaccinated. That puts selective pressure on the virus in itself.

Fundamentally, we are going to have to learn to live with the virus. But, that doesn't necessarily mean letting every kid get it at once and hoping for the best. That's really no different to Boris' plan 18 months ago.

Will have to agree to disagree.

Deaths are decreasing. Cases are rising but they are still testing loads of people unnecessarily.  We will find out later today what boris plans there are when he confirms the end of masks and distancing from 2 weeks from today.

I don’t have an issue with hospital numbers rising as cases rise until they change the reporting criteria. I know several here and in England who have counted as cases in hospital.  None of them new they had it and all were admitted for other reasons.

There are plenty of articles and opinions on both sides.  Personally until I hear people are genuinely becoming ill from now on (not interested in previous figures) I am well and truly of the belief that we have done all we can and that other than international travel everything throughout Britain should be normal ASAP.

Its scary what this has bought out in people.  Total fear of something that is no so statistically unlikely to harm you that it shouldn’t even be a thought in our daily lives.

[thommo2010]

22 minutes ago, Gladys said:

There are wittering on FB about a £400k payout for wrongful arrest and jailing and also smaller compensatory payments of a few thousand.  Is there any basis for these allegations? 

There is no chance someone is getting 400 grand compo.

[AlanShimmin]

3 minutes ago, thommo2010 said:

There is no chance someone is getting 400 grand compo.

Depends how good their lawyer is.

[Annoymouse]

Its obvious my way of thinking puts me in the minority. By rights we should be hit worse than the UK, we don’t have the level of herd immunity, we have zero restrictions, I don’t think we compare well with the UK as huge numbers of their vulnerable died from Covid last year so I’m not at all surprised that Covid deaths remain low in the UK, it’s effectively burning itself out. First in hospital should be this week, first in ICU will be 2-3 weeks after that, if I had to guess I’d say the first death will be 6-8 weeks after first admission, that’s only going from previous restrictions/lockdowns. We’ve already been told to expect serious illness and deaths, that’s all part of living with the virus, but it always hits a small community harder and it’s the only thing that makes people fearful.

[Gladys]

14 minutes ago, thommo2010 said:

There is no chance someone is getting 400 grand compo.

Well, that was my thought, but there were  rumblings of smaller awards. 

[Happier diner]

43 minutes ago, AcousticallyChallenged said:

First off, it's not about the current death rate, or hospitalisation. It's about how those are changing week on week as things happen. That chart paints a much less whimsical picture. You are familiar with exponential growth right?

The best spin they can put on it so far is that we have exponential case growth whilst hospitalisation is following a more linear trend. The other thing is, the positivity has been creeping up to over 5%, which is where the WHO say you shouldn't even consider lifting any further restrictions. It's a sign you're dropping the ball, which the tories have done a number of times.

Never mind that it's not just the kids it is ripping through, it's in the older age groups in places like Durham.

 

So COVID is definitely cutting about a bit, what does that actually mean for us?

Well, 2% of the population have post-COVID complications, or long COVID as you may want to call it. https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/conditionsanddiseases/bulletins/prevalenceofongoingsymptomsfollowingcoronaviruscovid19infectionintheuk/1july2021

An article in the BMJ says:

You can find it here: https://adc.bmj.com/content/early/2021/05/27/archdischild-2021-321882

Fundamentally, what is now taking place is a Tory-led medical experiment in children and young adults. We simply don't know how much damage it will do to that age group left unchecked.

Never mind that, you'll have a large unvaccinated reservoir of virus to circulate, with parents/grandparents/adults around who are vaccinated. That puts selective pressure on the virus in itself.

Fundamentally, we are going to have to learn to live with the virus. But, that doesn't necessarily mean letting every kid get it at once and hoping for the best. That's really no different to Boris' plan 18 months ago.

And what do you suggest we do different and for how long would we do it. Which is worst for kids 

1. having the vaccine 

2. Having the virus 

3. Having their life ruined by having no life.

Those are the tough choices this lady chooses to ignore

[Happier diner]

2 minutes ago, Annoymouse said:

Its obvious my way of thinking puts me in the minority. By rights we should be hit worse than the UK, we don’t have the level of herd immunity, we have zero restrictions, I don’t think we compare well with the UK as huge numbers of their vulnerable died from Covid last year so I’m not at all surprised that Covid deaths remain low in the UK, it’s effectively burning itself out. First in hospital should be this week, first in ICU will be 2-3 weeks after that, if I had to guess I’d say the first death will be 6-8 weeks after first admission, that’s only going from previous restrictions/lockdowns. We’ve already been told to expect serious illness and deaths, that’s all part of living with the virus, but it always hits a small community harder and it’s the only thing that makes people fearful.

Give it time. We are not out of the woods yet.

[quilp]

Relaxing restrictions will lead to 'variant factories' according to some UK scientists. Javid coming in for criticism as a "health secretary who still thinks it the 'flu"

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jul/04/uk-scientists-caution-that-lifting-of-covid-rules-is-like-building-variant-factories

 

[AcousticallyChallenged]

12 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

And what do you suggest we do different and for how long would we do it. Which is worst for kids 

1. having the vaccine 

2. Having the virus 

3. Having their life ruined by having no life.

Those are the tough choices this lady chooses to ignore

Option 4: Re-open, but encourage sensible measures whilst it's in circulation. As people here have mentioned before, ventilation is key and some businesses have added their own air filtration systems. Track and trace, that in the UK at least, isn't just your mate's company and a bit of a shitshow.

The 'lady' herself pointed out that nobody is saying don't reopen, but actually, vaccination needs to be supported by public health. For the people who can't have it, and the people who it won't work for.

Frankly, I think leaving it to personal responsibility is a load of rubbish. You either point out that it is something to worry about, and encourage public health measures, or you re-assure people that they can crack on as normal.

Otherwise, you do end up with people too scared to even leave the house to even pop to the shops, whilst, for the bulk of the population, people will crack on as normal. You end up mentally harming those you're trying to protect, whilst the people most likely to spread it are cracking on.

[quilp]

13 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

And what do you suggest we do different and for how long would we do it. Which is worst for kids..? 

1. having the vaccine

What is the science saying, do 'we' actually know..?

13 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

2. Having the virus..?

Opinions vary, to some, kids are safe, "they won't even know they've got/had it." 

13 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

3. Having their life ruined by having no life.

Is this a credible option? Their whole lives ruined..? Sounds very dramatic.

13 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

Those are the tough choices this lady chooses to ignore

For the many, not the few... 

[thommo2010]

20 minutes ago, Gladys said:

Well, that was my thought, but there were  rumblings of smaller awards. 

You've got to remember Gladys it's Facebook. If you believed everything on Facebook then you'd believe the island gets paid to take the UK pedophiles. That's something that doesn't happen either. 

[Happier diner]

4 minutes ago, AcousticallyChallenged said:

Option 4: Re-open, but encourage sensible measures whilst it's in circulation. As people here have mentioned before, ventilation is key and some businesses have added their own air filtration systems. Track and trace, that in the UK at least, isn't just your mate's company and a bit of a shitshow.

The 'lady' herself pointed out that nobody is saying don't reopen, but actually, vaccination needs to be supported by public health. For the people who can't have it, and the people who it won't work for.

Frankly, I think leaving it to personal responsibility is a load of rubbish. You either point out that it is something to worry about, and encourage public health measures, or you re-assure people that they can crack on as normal.

Otherwise, you do end up with people too scared to even leave the house to even pop to the shops, whilst, for the bulk of the population, people will crack on as normal. You end up mentally harming those you're trying to protect, whilst the people most likely to spread it are cracking on.

Accepted. But sensible measures cannot be placed on children. They are either locked down or at school and unrestricted. It just wouldn't work. Have you ever seen a class of 6 year olds together? 

[Utah 01]

2 hours ago, thommo2010 said:

all rational thinking seems

No - it went out the window 16 months ago because those that did stand back and really look at the potential economic and societal consequences of lockdown were either ignored or castigated by the MSM under government input.

[Happier diner]

3 minutes ago, quilp said:

What is the science saying, do 'we' actually know..?

Opinions vary, to some, kids are safe, "they won't even know they've got/had it." 

Is this a credible option? Their whole lives ruined..? Sounds very dramatic.

For the many, not the few... 

So then @quilp. Nail you colours. Which one.

[AcousticallyChallenged]

1 minute ago, Utah 01 said:

No - it went out the window 16 months ago because those that did stand back and really look at the potential economic and societal consequences of lockdown were either ignored or castigated by the MSM under government input.

If most of the world, and many of those Governments always looking for excuses to discredit each other, all agreed on COVID, what's the secret to the cooperation?

Global control conspiracy? or genuine health crisis?