IOM Covid removing restrictions

[John Wright]

16 minutes ago, iom_dave said:

One thing, i think the numbers they are comparing to Europe are out by a factor of 7:

The current Isle of Man rate of infection per 100,000 is roughly 277. For context, in Europe, only Cyprus, Gibraltar, the UK, Netherlands and Spain are higher. 1

The number of cases in Europe are quoted in terms of per week (as far as I can tell), whereas the IOM is running at 277 per day while the UK is 755 per fortnight.

https://qap.ecdc.europa.eu/public/extensions/COVID-19/COVID-19.html#global-overview-tab

Really hoping I've got the wrong end of the stick somewhere.

The way the EAG have used loose language is the issue here.

The standard figure, internationally, is normally, I think,  a 14 day average. But 7 day rates and other rates, are often and confusingly quoted. It’s an oranges, apples and pears thing.

[Roger Mexico]

52 minutes ago, Annoymouse said:

How can you safely assume it’s Delta? people would be off sick if it was Beta or Alpha too. Anyway that’s besides the point, the reason to monitor the variant is to record any possible sign of a mutation, something I don’t think is even of any concern, let alone being monitored.

That's not the only reason to monitor variants, different variants may have different symptoms for instance.  But we can be fairly sure that Delta is the dominant variant because of the situation in the UK.  This is from today's fortnightly VOC Report:

[AcousticallyChallenged]

10 minutes ago, Danoo said:

We don't need a debate on relaxation of the rules.

We can't keep making knee jerk reactions every time we have a rise in cases. The show must go on. People can exert their own risk management in their own sphere of influence but we need to stop looking for more government intervention and start to use our own discretion if we are to move forwards now.   

There hasn't been any knee jerk reaction to anything.

You've just got a proportion of people questioning the best way we can help that show to continue to go on.

The EAG's latest statement, around face coverings, health messaging and ventilation are all common sense measures, with minimal impact to daily life that will make a difference to the spread of the virus, as well as how safe people feel.

Pretending it's not a problem whilst it is ripping around, and we can't even manage to present accurate figures, doesn't instill confidence.

[Danoo]

15 minutes ago, AcousticallyChallenged said:

There hasn't been any knee jerk reaction to anything.

You've just got a proportion of people questioning the best way we can help that show to continue to go on.

The EAG's latest statement, around face coverings, health messaging and ventilation are all common sense measures, with minimal impact to daily life that will make a difference to the spread of the virus, as well as how safe people feel.

Pretending it's not a problem whilst it is ripping around, and we can't even manage to present accurate figures, doesn't instill confidence.

There wasn't anything in the EAG's statement that a reasonably intelligent person can't work out for themselves. It was just an exercise in waving their hands around and expelling a lot of hot air over nothing.

Do we need a government to repeat what they have said umpteen times over the past 18 months. If you want to wear a mask wear one. If you feel vulnerable avoid enclosed crowded spaces. Engage your own brain. Do your own risk management.

We don't need the nanny state to continually tell you how to live your life. Although some on the island have got so used to government sticking it's nose where it's not needed or wanted they feel anxious when they're left to their own devices. 

[cissolt]

33 minutes ago, Manx Yeller said:

Just when I thought I couldn't dislike the CM more.....

The Chief Minister Howard Quayle MHK said:

'Overnight, a number of members of Tynwald have approached ministers to request that the Government again brings forward the proposed changes to the Island’s COVID-19 regulations. The Council of Ministers has agreed to do so.

'I hope those members of Tynwald who were unsure, or who wanted to more fully consider the proposals, have had the time they need. The changes we are proposing broadly reflect a workshop with Tynwald members held on 8 July. 

'If Tynwald votes the same as yesterday, then I must be clear that the changes proposed will not be brought forward.'

 

So Tynwald members say they'd like advice from EAG before voting and HQ slags them off for doing so. EAG get 5 minutes notice to provide some advice on it before a meeting but don't get all the information. They say they'll issue a further more in-depth analysis by middle of next week and CM says vote for it today or I'll take my ball away. Ridiculous.

Have they voted on the changed? It will be interesting to see how was coerced into changing their vote

[Annoymouse]

11 minutes ago, Danoo said:

There wasn't anything in the EAG's statement that a reasonably intelligent person can't work out for themselves.

If that was the case we wouldn’t be in this mess in the first place.

[BenFairfax]

48 minutes ago, Danoo said:

We don't need a debate on relaxation of the rules.

We can't keep making knee jerk reactions every time we have a rise in cases. The show must go on. People can exert their own risk management in their own sphere of influence but we need to stop looking for more government intervention and start to use our own discretion if we are to move forwards now. 

Think this is the plan, but I think people deserve to have clear guidance on the risk level so they can then act in accordance with their preference. Not sure all 2+2 High risk group are aware they are not bullet proof. I simple letter from GP/Consultant, and perhaps a few mask ONLY hours at Tesco, chemist etc would would this constituent to make real choices.

[Zarley]

15 minutes ago, cissolt said:

Have they voted on the changed? It will be interesting to see how was coerced into changing their vote

They're still debating. It's on Manx Radio AM right now. 

[AcousticallyChallenged]

1 minute ago, Danoo said:

There wasn't anything in the EAG's statement that a reasonably intelligent person can't work out for themselves. It was just an exercise in waving their hands around and expelling a lot of hot air over nothing.

Do we need a government to repeat what they have said umpteen times over the past 18 months. If you want to wear a mask wear one. If you feel vulnerable avoid enclosed crowded spaces. Engage your own brain. Do your own risk management.

We don't need the nanny state to continually tell you how to live your life. Although some on the island have got so used to government sticking it's nose where it's not needed or wanted they feel anxious when they're left to their own devices. 

Correct, it isn't exactly rocket science.

What we've had for the last 18 months is bluster, derision, name-calling and shredded letters. Hardly liable to instill confidence, is it?

This isn't about the nanny state, or anything else. It's about being honest with people, when you're right and when you're wrong, rather than an egoistical parade where we're told it's all going to plan at any given moment. To empower people to make their own decisions, the information needs to be put across readily.

[AcousticallyChallenged]

1 minute ago, offshoremanxman said:

We don’t but right at the start of this a load of people were so made so petrified that they willingly handed their lives over to government. And now they can’t wean themselves off the dependency. The number of people who still ask me ‘Are we allowed to do such and such’ really gets in my wick. Before this when did anyone ever feel the need to ask anyone if they were allowed to go on holiday to a certain country or use the boat? 

FCO has put out travel guidance for years, there are plenty of places they'd recommend against, long before COVID.

[Zarley]

6 minutes ago, Annoymouse said:

If that was the case we wouldn’t be in this mess in the first place.

People who don't want to be bothered with masks like to ignore the the fact that a mask protects other people more than it does the wearer. 

It's no good telling people to wear a mask if they want when it will only really protect them when others wear them as well. 

Personal responsibility? Yes. Be personally responsible for protecting the community of which you are a member. 

[NoTailT]

Alf coming across like a right tosser right now in the house.

[WTF]

2 hours ago, Andy Onchan said:

Ben - How long have you been doing these COVID forecasts/models?

since his crystal ball arrived from ali express.

[Danoo]

2 minutes ago, offshoremanxman said:

We don’t but right at the start of this a load of people were made so petrified that they willingly handed their lives over to government. And now they can’t wean themselves off the dependency. The number of people who still ask me ‘Are we allowed to do such and such’ really gets on my wick. Before this when did anyone ever feel the need to ask anyone if they were allowed to go on holiday to a certain country or use the boat? 

I agree to a certain extent. At the start our administration looked at the authoritarian actions around the world and assumed they had to do similar. Don't forget these are men and women of limited intellect thrust into making decisions way above their pay grade and they got drunk on the power. 

However since then they have quite rightly taken their hand off the tiller and left the public to work it out for themselves in order to get society moving again and the wheels of what little industry we have to keep moving.  

We can't keep on looking for guidance from government. Everyone knows someone who is isolating/tested positive so they are aware that things have stepped up a gear. Make provisions accordingly. It's not difficult.   

[Annoymouse]

If we can trust people to mitigate their own risks as they see fit, why does health & safety even exist? It’s all common sense stuff that any reasonably intelligent person can understand isn’t it?  Why do we have things like hygiene rules in commercial kitchens? I mean its all self explanatory isn’t it?