IOM Covid removing restrictions

[Banker]

4 minutes ago, Cambon said:

Yes. His suggestion is test on arrival, bring back social distancing, limit the size of gatherings indoors and out, close all night clubs, cinemas and similar venues, wearing of masks in retail outlets, and live on a wing and a prayer that the virus does not get back into the community, which will happen because it is uncontrollable, according to nom de plume.

And your suggestion of doing no testing and keeping everyone out is a long term solution to disaster!

we could as a minimum follow Howie best mates Guernsey who allow non residents in and are investing in infrastructure for next phase of testing on arrival 

[Andy Onchan]

2 minutes ago, Cambon said:

Yes. His suggestion is test on arrival, bring back social distancing, limit the size of gatherings indoors and out, close all night clubs, cinemas and similar venues, wearing of masks in retail outlets, and live on a wing and a prayer that the virus does not get back into the community, which will happen because it is uncontrollable, according to nom de plume.

I'm not arguing (believe it or not!) with NDP's comments except that it's a bit vague.... kind of "do something, anything" and the constant regurgitation of the same thing over and over again, full circle and that includes the Jersey 'model'. It's like, if you say it often enough it will happen. Well, life outside an anonymous user forum ain't like that. 

I'm pretty sure that IOMG haven't got it 100% right up to now and no doubt Jersey will have issues and both Islands will get something wrong at sometime in the future but there is a bigger picture out there with all sorts of data and scenarios being thrown into the ring. Some of it contradictory or at least at odds with what we think we know.

[Cambon]

1 hour ago, Banker said:

And your suggestion of doing no testing and keeping everyone out is a long term solution to disaster!

we could as a minimum follow Howie best mates Guernsey who allow non residents in and are investing in infrastructure for next phase of testing on arrival 

Actually, my suggestion is seven days and test, as we are now, allow approved family and friends in, also allow limited business trips, with test on arrival and allow back to work on negative test with same restrictions as seven days and test. No more yet.

Guernsey and jersey will be demanding 14 days isolation for all North West arrivals within a week, so we will then be ahead of them anyway. 

It actually would not surprise me if Jersey went to 7 days and test at the end of September. 

[Banker]

4 minutes ago, Cambon said:

Actually, my suggestion is seven days and test, as we are now, allow approved family and friends in, also allow limited business trips, with test on arrival and allow back to work on negative test with same restrictions as seven days and test. No more yet.

Guernsey and jersey will be demanding 14 days isolation for all North West arrivals within a week, so we will then be ahead of them anyway. 

It actually would not surprise me if Jersey went to 7 days and test at the end of September. 

So you don’t suggest spending on infrastructure like Channel Islands to allow testing on arrivals, this seems to be sensible to most.

by the way Jersey active cases now only 10 , 92000 tests and ports arrivals back upto 50% of normal compared to our 1/2% so I guess Jersey have it wrong!!

[Nom de plume]

11 minutes ago, Banker said:

So you don’t suggest spending on infrastructure like Channel Islands to allow testing on arrivals, this seems to be sensible to most.

by the way Jersey active cases now only 10 , 92000 tests and ports arrivals back upto 50% of normal compared to our 1/2% so I guess Jersey have it wrong!!

Jersey are fools, state sponsored genocide.

The locals should be all over the forums calling for the WHO to intervene.

Madness.

Edited September 9, 2020 by Nom de plume

[Cambon]

40 minutes ago, Banker said:

So you don’t suggest spending on infrastructure like Channel Islands to allow testing on arrivals, this seems to be sensible to most.

by the way Jersey active cases now only 10 , 92000 tests and ports arrivals back upto 50% of normal compared to our 1/2% so I guess Jersey have it wrong!!

Firstly, Jersey are spending on testing infrastructure. Right now, all there tests are processed in the uk. Guernsey and Iom already have that infrastructure.

secondly, how many new active cases have they had since July when they started testing in arrival? 

Thirdly, how much would it cost us to close all those businesses (nightclubs, etc). You want to make those people unemployed, so you can have a holibob! 

[Neil Down]

8 minutes ago, Cambon said:

Firstly, Jersey are spending on testing infrastructure. Right now, all there tests are processed in the uk. Guernsey and Iom already have that infrastructure.

secondly, how many new active cases have they had since July when they started testing in arrival? 

Thirdly, how much would it cost us to close all those businesses (nightclubs, etc). You want to make those people unemployed, so you can have a holibob! 

Nothing is stopping him going on holiday. However, he is selfish enough to want everybody to suffer the consequences of his actions

[TheTeapot]

I see Jersey is handing out £100 ' shop local' vouchers to everyone who lives there, kids included, because their economy is doing so well. If we're going to copy them then I'd accept that.

[Happier diner]

1 hour ago, Cambon said:

Firstly, Jersey are spending on testing infrastructure. Right now, all there tests are processed in the uk. Guernsey and Iom already have that infrastructure.

secondly, how many new active cases have they had since July when they started testing in arrival? 

Thirdly, how much would it cost us to close all those businesses (nightclubs, etc). You want to make those people unemployed, so you can have a holibob! 

Cambon - You have suddenly started talking good sense. Good to hear. Seems everyone is agreeing that;

1) We have put the brakes on (with great success)

2) We need a step forward at some point

To do this there will be some risks. Ashie and Howie have done a good job with the brakes (applying fully thereof), but do they have the skill and courage to start moving forward slowly instead of just applying the handbrake and thinking job done? Time will tell!

[Out of the blue]

3 hours ago, Utah 01 said:

I listened to Hopeless Hancock being interviewed by JH-B on talkradio this morning.  He first started with the condescending line 'basically I've got access to the data (I'm being fed by Witty et al) and you haven't' but the more he was pressed for any form of justification or the apparent idiocies of his new regulations, the fluster meter started to go off the scale.

One of the main reasons the politicos are able to get away with this fraud is the total absence of any, serious questioning.  The MSM, with a few exceptions, have rolled over and taken the government terro campaign hook, line and sinker.  But news of a toilet that has gone unisex in Ilford that has gone 'trans' and you'll never hear the end of it.

I commend watching the first 10 minutes or so of this in which Prof Henighan presents everything Hancock (and Mr Toad) won't tell you and don't want you to know.

 

 

 

A very good summation of the current situation, with clear and logical non politicised suggestions for future policy. 

[Banker]

1 hour ago, Cambon said:

Firstly, Jersey are spending on testing infrastructure. Right now, all there tests are processed in the uk. Guernsey and Iom already have that infrastructure.

secondly, how many new active cases have they had since July when they started testing in arrival? 

Thirdly, how much would it cost us to close all those businesses (nightclubs, etc). You want to make those people unemployed, so you can have a holibob! 

Stop talking shit! What nightclubs are you on about to close! Jersey restaurants etc are booming!

we have no infrastructure for testing on arrival which is what Channel Islands are doing.

you of course want unemployment through the roof here to prove some sort of sick point

[thesultanofsheight]

4 hours ago, Utah 01 said:

I listened to Hopeless Hancock being interviewed by JH-B on talkradio this morning.  He first started with the condescending line 'basically I've got access to the data (I'm being fed by Witty et al) and you haven't' but the more he was pressed for any form of justification or the apparent idiocies of his new regulations, the fluster meter started to go off the scale.

Hopeless Matt Handjob is as useless as Johnson. The latest announcements are bordering on insanity. One week they’re paying people to eat out in bars and restaurants on quiet nights as not enough people are going out and the next they’re locking the same places down. They’re totally clueless. The economic damage they’re causing by trying to bluff their way through this is incredible. 

Edited September 9, 2020 by thesultanofsheight

[Cambon]

42 minutes ago, Banker said:

Stop talking shit! What nightclubs are you on about to close! Jersey restaurants etc are booming!

we have no infrastructure for testing on arrival which is what Channel Islands are doing.

you of course want unemployment through the roof here to prove some sort of sick point

Look at Jersey's restrictions! They are still in semi lock down with social distancing. I don't know about you, but I don't want that here so that a couple of thousand relatives can visit here and 85,000 residents can go away to spend money they could be and are spending here. 

 

[pongo]

4 hours ago, Banker said:

So you don’t suggest spending on infrastructure like Channel Islands to allow testing on arrivals, this seems to be sensible to most.

@rachomics did a great job of explaining the issues around "testing on arrivals".

In what ways do you disagee?

 

On 9/6/2020 at 2:15 PM, rachomics said:

...  I am a scientist who understands that if you test someone on the day they arrive and their exposure to the virus was at on the way to the ferry/plane, that test is going to come up negative because no test in the world can give a result based on exposure. The test is for actual infection, whether symptomatic or asymptomatic.

So let's say that we test everyone on arrival. We end up giving out a large number of negative results to people who are going to be going into isolation for at least 7 days anyway. Here's where the psychology comes in, and you'll have to ask yourselves how you would behave if someone said you tested negative for COVID19 the day you arrived. Would you stick to strict isolation even though you have a negative test result from your arrival test? I'd bet that there's a good number in the population who would be a little less strict with themselves because they've been told they're negative. Now, if one of those people tests negative at the border and then develops an asymptomatic infection, or goes out the day before they develop symptoms, then we'd have a significant community transmission on our hands and we'd be back to square one.

If we tested on arrival and there was no isolation period at all we would have a fairly serious problem rather quickly. It only takes one asymptomatic person to start a community transmission chain and we'd be back in lockdown. Just because this hasn't happened in Jersey doesn't mean that it won't. It means Jersey have been very, very lucky (so far). 

This is why testing on day 7 of isolation is a good risk-based compromise as if someone is exposed in the week before travelling (or even on the day of travel) there's a significant chance that they'll test positive on day 7. They would likely test negative on arrival and that's nothing to do with the testing methodology but just the basic biology of how viral infections proceed. 

 

[thesultanofsheight]

4 minutes ago, pongo said:

@rachomics Just because this hasn't happened in Jersey doesn't mean that it won't. It means Jersey have been very, very lucky (so far). 

It’s been as lucky as the IOM has been so far. But the IOM is simply winging it worse by simply not testing people. No test = no test results = nobody has covid!! Except when we start testing them and suddenly they have! 

Edited September 9, 2020 by thesultanofsheight