pongo Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 (edited) 36 minutes ago, trmpton said: Chamber of Commerce pushing for border testing. Are you sure? I'm fairly certain that the Chamber has not expressed an opinion - only that it has published the results of a survey. The person responsible for the petition you have linked to seems to have extrapolated their own conclusions. https://www.iomchamber.org.im/chamber-news/results-of-recent-borders-testing-survey-november-2020/ Edited November 4, 2020 by pongo 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 (edited) More on that survey of Chamber members' views: 59% of respondents support the Government’s decision to rescind the 7-day test and 58% believe the Government should offer salary support for any employees that test positive for COVID for a further 14 days. An overwhelming 87% believe the Isle of Man should have mandatory testing on arrival to the Island and 70% believe individuals should be tested before leaving 14-day isolation. 75% believe that if an individual is isolating in the household the whole household should also isolate. When an employee is sharing a household with an individual that is self-isolating half the businesses who responded insist on the employee working from home. 59% of respondents feel the Government should offer salary support for employees that test positive for COVID and are unable to work from home. There was a 50/50% split in opinion on productivity being affected by employees working from home. 70% believe the Isle of Man should have mandatory testing on individuals prior to leaving isolation. 62% of respondents agreed with the introduction of the new Civil Contingencies Bill. Edited November 4, 2020 by pongo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 3 minutes ago, pongo said: Are you sure? I'm fairly certain that the Chamber has not expressed an opinion - only that it has puplished the results of a survey. The person responsible for the petition you have linked to seems to have extrapolated their own opinions. https://www.iomchamber.org.im/chamber-news/results-of-recent-borders-testing-survey-november-2020/ There's other parts of the survey (which was of 143 businesses rather than of individuals) that they seem less keen to consider: 59% of respondents support the Government’s decision to rescind the 7-day test 70% believe individuals should be tested before leaving 14-day isolation. 75% believe that if an individual is isolating in the household the whole household should also isolate. Like most such demands, the petitioners seem mainly concerned that they should be allowed to do whatever they want without considering the consequences for others. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nom de plume Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 Another new case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 6 minutes ago, Nom de plume said: Another new case. Get ready for Facebook mob to shout close the borders!!! In reality there are only key workers, hospital patients and returning students traveling at present but won’t stop the mob!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 36 minutes ago, Nom de plume said: Another new case. According to IOM Newspapers: It involves a patient transfer case who was already self-isolating. Contact tracing is under way. IOM Newspapers seem to be the least 'creative' with these press release, so it may match what the government actually put out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nom de plume Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 12 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said: According to IOM Newspapers: It involves a patient transfer case who was already self-isolating. Contact tracing is under way. IOM Newspapers seem to be the least 'creative' with these press release, so it may match what the government actually put out. So ... flown over with various others? Taxi / lift? In addition to any other locals they might have come into contact with on the journey back? It’s all a bit ambiguous. They’ve contact traced everyone I’m sure - strokes chin. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 Guernsey source identified so Howie can reopen air bridge again, however he probably won't! https://guernseypress.com/news/2020/11/04/source-of-cluster-identified-by-public-health/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 16 minutes ago, Banker said: Guernsey source identified so Howie can reopen air bridge again, however he probably won't! https://guernseypress.com/news/2020/11/04/source-of-cluster-identified-by-public-health/ The trouble is that we don't really know if the outbreak has been completely suppressed: 10 positive cases were identified in this cluster – six were related to a specific venue (which was not the source of the original infection), three were family members and one was a work colleague (again not the source of the original infection). Until all those who might have been infected, especially via the venue (because of its potential for wider spread) are know to be clear at least 14 days after possible infection or secondary infection, we can't be absolutely clear. So it's important not just to test, but to retest. It started about 16 days ago so another week might confirm that, I think the last related case was about 10 days ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Roger Mexico said: The trouble is that we don't really know if the outbreak has been completely suppressed: 10 positive cases were identified in this cluster – six were related to a specific venue (which was not the source of the original infection), three were family members and one was a work colleague (again not the source of the original infection). Until all those who might have been infected, especially via the venue (because of its potential for wider spread) are know to be clear at least 14 days after possible infection or secondary infection, we can't be absolutely clear. So it's important not just to test, but to retest. It started about 16 days ago so another week might confirm that, I think the last related case was about 10 days ago. If you read the full article they have identified all contacts as well as testing 3000 in the community since end September so seems as safe as IOM in my humble opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 11 minutes ago, Banker said: If you read the full article they have identified all contacts as well as testing 3000 in the community since end September so seems as safe as IOM in my humble opinion I did read the full article, but there's still a danger that there are contacts from the initial cases that tested negative a few days after contact but would now be positive - hence my point about retesting. It's obviously a lower chance than it would have been say a week ago, but they're not quite clear yet. How safe the Island is is another matter, especially with the possibility of household transmission and then into the community. The government should have been more proactive in helping people to isolate safely, but as usual seem to mistake having meetings about things with actually do them. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted November 5, 2020 Share Posted November 5, 2020 Chamber calls for more testing at border and at 3/5 days as now impacting severely on new business, other islands do testing on arrival. https://www.manxradio.com/news/isle-of-man-news/manx-businesses-back-border-testing/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trmpton Posted November 5, 2020 Share Posted November 5, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Banker said: Chamber calls for more testing at border and at 3/5 days as now impacting severely on new business, other islands do testing on arrival. https://www.manxradio.com/news/isle-of-man-news/manx-businesses-back-border-testing/ Agree completely with Jason. In fact he might have been reading my posts on here for the last couple of months. That is exactly what’s needed as as much as lots on here keep denying it it’s the view of a lot of intelligent and experienced business figures. Good on him for being the one to put his name to it and speak out in public. Hopefully lots will get behind him, but the pitchfork mentality around being COVID free will put a lot off speaking out (in public. Despite saying the same behind closed doors) Edited November 5, 2020 by trmpton 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nom de plume Posted November 5, 2020 Share Posted November 5, 2020 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Banker said: Chamber calls for more testing at border and at 3/5 days as now impacting severely on new business, other islands do testing on arrival. https://www.manxradio.com/news/isle-of-man-news/manx-businesses-back-border-testing/ We are hanging out for two things to solve this mess: 1) A vaccine 2) An election There is nothing outside of this Blue Sky thinking. PS - if we are to get to Level 2, the UK needs to bring its new infection rate below 30 in 100,000 & even then as the Guernsey air bridge debacle proved, HQ will move the goal posts to protect nirvana status. Edited November 5, 2020 by Nom de plume Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tetchtyke Posted November 5, 2020 Share Posted November 5, 2020 (edited) There is an exemption in the regs for people to come in if they are essential to the economy of the island. So key business people can come in if they need to. I'm not sure what those demanding tests want to see happen with those tests. Testing on arrival is not accurate, and so it would be risky to exempt people from self-isolation solely on the basis of a negative test on arrival. I also think there's a real risk that testing on arrival would undermine quarantine by giving people a false sense of security. There's also the issue with testing capacity. So if you're not going to do anything with the result, why bother with the test? Testing on arrival is available and is used for some medical staff, but even then they have to self-isolate when not at work, and wear full medical PPE at work. I'm not sure businessmen are wanting to go to work in medical PPE, so... Edited November 5, 2020 by tetchtyke 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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