Barlow Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 10 minutes ago, Black Mirror said: if such compulsion does happen, it is something that it is going to be deeply regretted later on. Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Right Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, pongo said: I doubt it will be compulsory. But I suspect that that health passports will be a de facto requirement enforced by employers, private companies and organisations because their staff, customers and shareholders demand it. For example, to fly, land in another country, go to a supermarket, the cinema, university, place of employment etc. Why? This pandemic is seeing off very low numbers and those who are going are in acknowledged high risk groups. It’s hard to see that everyone will be clamoring to force inject people with a cure to something that won’t kill them and which won’t kill anyone around them either. What you seem to be talking about is hype and conformity. The minute class actions rear their heads (as they will in the US especially) they will change their tune on vaccination to access services. Edited November 25, 2020 by All Right Typo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boswellian Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 On 11/22/2020 at 9:56 PM, Roger Mexico said: Obviously if no one is tested then there won't be any positive test results, but there could still be infections - hopefully only among those isolating. But every positive test result is an infection - as Rachel explained in her excellent presentation 'false positives' are very rare indeed in the type of testing we use on the Island. What may lie behind this question is the belief that a positive test somehow doesn't mean that it is a 'proper' case of Covid-19 if there are no symptoms. This simply isn't true - the definition of the disease is a lab test showing the presence of the organism that causes it. What is more this is true of every infectious disease, not just Covid-19. It has to be this way, because no disease has a unique set of symptoms which every infected person has and which no person suffering from any other disease does. It's the way medicine works. And in this infection there's also the fact that we know those not showing any symptoms can infect others - even if they never go on to show any later. The number of completely asymptomatic people may be lower than has been thought - latest estimates are about 20% - but they can still give it to others. It is good to be free of fear. Fear is very bad for the immune system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apple Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 1 hour ago, pongo said: I doubt it will be compulsory. I think it will be voluntary, at first. the we will be 'nudged' to have it. We will no doubt hear much, much more about the hew normal and gradually lose our 'choices' in order to to enjoy our 'freedoms'. Bit like banks and post offices I suppose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AcousticallyChallenged Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 1 hour ago, All Right said: Why? This pandemic is seeing off very low numbers and those who are going are in acknowledged high risk groups. It’s hard to see that everyone will be clamoring to force inject people with a cure to something that won’t kill them and which won’t kill anyone around them either. What you seem to be talking about is hype and conformity. The minute class actions rear their heads (as they will in the US especially) they will change their tune on vaccination to access services. You say this like vaccination isn't a common requirement anyway. In France, you have to have proof of a number of vaccinations before you're allowed to send your child to school. https://www.thelocal.fr/20190906/which-vaccinations-are-compulsory-for-children-in-france In a number of places, you'll need to prove you've been vaccinated against nasties to travel to or from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 1 hour ago, All Right said: Why? This pandemic is seeing off very low numbers and those who are going are in acknowledged high risk groups. It’s hard to see that everyone will be clamoring to force inject people with a cure to something that won’t kill them and which won’t kill anyone around them either. What you seem to be talking about is hype and conformity. The minute class actions rear their heads (as they will in the US especially) they will change their tune on vaccination to access services. Nobody is going to be forcing anyone to be injected or to conform. Or to take a flight, visit another country, go to the supermarket etc. Be free. You can even be a rebel and paint your bedroom black if your really want. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Right Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 7 hours ago, pongo said: Nobody is going to be forcing anyone to be injected or to conform. Or to take a flight, visit another country, go to the supermarket etc. Confusing, you appear to say one thing then you say the exact opposite in an apparent attempt to try to sound clever. It’s either one thing or the other surely? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nom de plume Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 3 hours ago, All Right said: Confusing, you appear to say one thing then you say the exact opposite in an apparent attempt to try to sound clever. It’s either one thing or the other surely? Yes, it’s conform or lose your basic freedoms to travel & exist. There is no middle ground. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apple Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 27 minutes ago, Nom de plume said: Yes, it’s conform or lose your basic freedoms to travel & exist. Conform is such an ugly word, isn't it. Lets say we will be nudged in the right direction. All for the benefit of the many of course. Perhaps even make it a condition of our travel insurance. Or maybe we will have to "Opt out". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All Right Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 28 minutes ago, Nom de plume said: Yes, it’s conform or lose your basic freedoms to travel & exist. There is no middle ground. Well yes which was my point but I’m confused as to why someone who posted “But I suspect that that health passports will be a de facto requirement enforced by employers, private companies and organisations because their staff, customers and shareholders demand it” then sort of mocks me for suggesting that people will likely be forced to comply with vaccination requirements as that’s what they said too. I don’t believe it will be mandatory but I do believe the world has lost its head to such an alarming degree that it’s likely inevitable that you will see your life being restricted if you don’t conform with their expectations and requirements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 Is there a reason we can’t use the rapid testing described below being used in UK to try & ease travel restrictions? Tier-three areas will be eligible for rapid or "lateral flow" coronavirus tests - which give results in about 20 minutes without the need for a lab - to help bring down infections and reduce restrictions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambon Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 1 hour ago, Nom de plume said: Yes, it’s conform or lose your basic freedoms to travel & exist. There is no middle ground. So, have you had a vaccine to prevent you getting the Spanish flu, which was a hell of a lot worse than this, and is still out there? No.. Are they even trying to create a vaccine against it? No. The point is, this virus will lean to survive with us in a couple years time. In the meantime, those at risk need to be protected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Cambon said: So, have you had a vaccine to prevent you getting the Spanish flu, which was a hell of a lot worse than this, and is still out there? No.. Are they even trying to create a vaccine against it? No. The point is, this virus will lean to survive with us in a couple years time. In the meantime, those at risk need to be protected. So you’re saying Spanish flu is circulating and no one is immune, have you reported this to WHO as maybe news to them😂 Edited November 26, 2020 by Banker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 15 minutes ago, Cambon said: So, have you had a vaccine to prevent you getting the Spanish flu, which was a hell of a lot worse than this, and is still out there? No.. Are they even trying to create a vaccine against it? No. The point is, this virus will lean to survive with us in a couple years time. In the meantime, those at risk need to be protected. Last known outbreak was April 1920, either immunity had grown to sufficient levels to stop spread ( 500 million out of total word population of 1,500 million infected in two years ) or it had mutated to be less infectious and dangerous. More likely to be a combination. What would anyone be vaccinated against a non existent flu? And if it did come back then the flu vaccine, which is changed annually to make it effective against the flu types most widely circulating, would be changed to include it. When was the last outbreak reported? Where? in what circumstances? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AcousticallyChallenged Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 4 hours ago, Banker said: Is there a reason we can’t use the rapid testing described below being used in UK to try & ease travel restrictions? Tier-three areas will be eligible for rapid or "lateral flow" coronavirus tests - which give results in about 20 minutes without the need for a lab - to help bring down infections and reduce restrictions The lateral flow tests aren't nearly as accurate are they? They might be good enough for a 'you've definitely got it, you're not getting on the boat', but not for allowing people out and about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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