Black Lives Matter

[the stinking enigma]

Schumacher didn't have the balls to let his team mate race against him, so once he was in the best car, which the Ferrari was, then he couldn't really lose. 

  Verstappen is pretty fast but he still hasn't raced a season where he has had the pressure of maybe winning the title at the end of it, ever race is still like a one off to him. Hamilton was world champion in his second season, very nearly his first. The question in a black/white sense is not how hamilton made it to formula one but why there are not more black midfield average drivers. Hamilton would have won races in any era, had he the opportunity to compete

[wrighty]

6 hours ago, Max Power said:

I often wondered if it's something they don't generally tend to excel at, a bit like swimming etc? There are less expensive forms of motorsport and some very wealthy black people, not many white people from low income backgrounds can get involved so it's a bit unfair to say that it's solely white privilege. In countries where motor sport is popular there is a white majority which skews it further.      

By ‘they’ do you mean black? So are you saying ‘they’ can’t drive or swim particularly well?

I’m being deliberately provocative here, exactly in the way Stu’s callers were, but you are stereotyping. The swimming argument has been debunked. It is all about privilege - access to a pool, parents that get up with you at 5am to go training before school every day (why do they do that?) - rather than genetics, or heavy bones etc. And as for motorsport - it’s all expensive. I’m from a working class background. There’s no way I could have had my own go-cart and raced at weekends as a kid - we couldn’t have afforded it, let alone not having a garage in which to store it or a van/trailer to transport it between circuits. I’m aware there are some DIYers with sidecar outfits and the like over here who perhaps manage to race on a shoestring budget, but that is certainly not the norm in motorsport generally which is for white privileged folk in the main. 

[WTF]

16 hours ago, Gladys said:

Possibly, it would be more correct to say more racially aware than white people.  I have to say, I have been pretty colour blind before all this BLM stuff, taking people as I find them regardless of colour, but am much more aware and careful for fear of inadvertently causing offence.  

but for the most part it doesn't actually cause offence, it just gives some people something to claim they are offended about so they can  get some attention.

[WTF]

37 minutes ago, wrighty said:

By ‘they’ do you mean black? So are you saying ‘they’ can’t drive or swim particularly well?

I’m being deliberately provocative here, exactly in the way Stu’s callers were, but you are stereotyping. The swimming argument has been debunked. It is all about privilege - access to a pool, parents that get up with you at 5am to go training before school every day (why do they do that?) - rather than genetics, or heavy bones etc. And as for motorsport - it’s all expensive. I’m from a working class background. There’s no way I could have had my own go-cart and raced at weekends as a kid - we couldn’t have afforded it, let alone not having a garage in which to store it or a van/trailer to transport it between circuits. I’m aware there are some DIYers with sidecar outfits and the like over here who perhaps manage to race on a shoestring budget, but that is certainly not the norm in motorsport generally which is for white privileged folk in the main. 

i disagree,  racing is for ANYBODY that can actually afford it,  as are most things,  being able to afford something in the first place is the issue, 99% ( out of arse guess ) of any colour people can't afford the lifestyle of their dreams.  there seem to be a lot of rich people around the planet that aren't white, they just don't want to go motor racing or sponsor it.  piss take point, camel racing is an expensive sport enjoyed by the wealthy in some arab states, i doubt there are many wealthy white boys involved in that game,  the whites race horses instead.  Trying to bypass  the millennia  and centuries of history and culture that have gotten us to where  are now in a relatively short span of time is very optimistic,  the last century has seen a lot of positive changes towards colour and gender now enshrined in law but there is still a long way to go, and it won't happen over night, it will be centuries if ever at all as we are legislating against our human nature. the current climate is trying force evolution, it wont work for everyone or be easy

Edited June 28, 2020 by WTF

[Neil Down]

8 hours ago, HeliX said:

Convincing counterargument.

No need to add anything further to your apologist posting. You're the type that makes an excuse on somebody else's behalf. You get offended on behalf of others. Quite pitiful really

[Neil Down]

9 hours ago, wrighty said:

TT - tradition, basically here and Ireland where a relatively small proportion of the population is black. Are there any white TT winners from London?

Pro-cyclists - There will be. But gear and opportunity are things with this too.  

Snooker/Darts - white working class pub culture tradition

Golf - it’s only recently that it’s opened up to working class. Golf is very much traditionally a middle class bank manager/accountant/hospital consultant pastime. 
 

I don’t think I am on the wrong track. Privilege isn’t all class and money either. It’s sometimes pushy/supportive parents - Tiger Woods, Lewis Hamilton and the Williams sisters being examples of where black competitors have excelled in white majority events due to their fathers. 

I had you down as better than that wrighty.

TT - where do you think riders go to ply their trade? short courses around the UK. Not every successful TT winner had a privileged background. A large number of them work bloody hard to earn money to do the thing they love

Pro-cyclists - as per above

Snooker/darts - correct

Golf - when you say recently, some black golfers played their golf in 1930's. Here's ten you can easily look up

• Charlie Sifford.
• Lee Elder.
• Calvin Peete.
• Althea Gibson.
• Renee Powell.
• Ted Rhodes.
• Pete Brown.
• Cheyenne Woods.
• Charles Owen.
• Bill Spiller.

bottom line in this is that it is not always about so called "white privilege" but more about the desire to succeed

[The Dog's Dangly Bits]

Genetics plays a part.  Sprinting would be a good example.  Never been a top class white male 100m sprinter really.  That has nothing to do with privilege, money or opportunity. 

[TheTeapot]

Christophe Lemitaire has run 9.92 and 19.80 for the 100 and 200 metres. That's top class.

[The Dog's Dangly Bits]

Just now, TheTeapot said:

Christophe Lemitaire has run 9.92 and 19.80 for the 100 and 200 metres. That's top class.

It isn't anywhere close to winning the biggest prizes in the sport.  Black athletes have utterly dominated top class sprinting.

CL is a decent enough sprinter.  He's also in a very very small percentage of white sprinters that even make the biggest finals.   Let alone win them.

Those times are respectable.   And miles away from the records for those events.

[TheTeapot]

7 minutes ago, The Dog's Dangly Bits said:

It isn't anywhere close to winning the biggest prizes in the sport.  Black athletes have utterly dominated top class sprinting.

CL is a decent enough sprinter.  He's also in a very very small percentage of white sprinters that even make the biggest finals.   Let alone win them.

Those times are respectable.   And miles away from the records for those events.

I know this. You said there has never been a top class white male sprinter. He has individual olympic and world championship bronze medals, as well as european golds. You can't win an olympic medal of any kind without being 'top class'.

[quilp]

https://unherd.com/2020/06/cambridge-universitys-very-modern-bigotry/

A 5-minute read by Douglas Murray. I posted earlier about this woman, and the selective stance taken by Cambridge University regarding its policies on no-platforming academics who don't or won't toe the line. The MSM has been very quiet on this Doctor's divisive and racist statement, "White lives don't matter" and has given little coverage to the university's reaction and defence of this employee. A white person would be hung, drawn and quartered had the roles been reversed.

Edited to add: A petition raised on change.org, signed up to by 20,000+ people to have her sacked, has been removed by the website. In comparison, take the furore over the "White Lives Matter Burnley" banner, the 'perpetrators' get sacked from their jobs and publicly vilified with great fanfare yet this hateful racist Doctor gets promoted by the university...

Edited June 28, 2020 by quilp

[Kopek]

"White lives don't matter" . '' As white lives ''.

Can you explain the second sentence? Perhaps the two sentences together?

Maybe she means that we are all human beings and that colour doesn't matter? ( or shouldn't ).

[Shake me up Judy]

3 hours ago, wrighty said:

By ‘they’ do you mean black? So are you saying ‘they’ can’t drive or swim particularly well?

I’m being deliberately provocative here, exactly in the way Stu’s callers were, but you are stereotyping. The swimming argument has been debunked. It is all about privilege - access to a pool, parents that get up with you at 5am to go training before school every day (why do they do that?) - rather than genetics, or heavy bones etc. And as for motorsport - it’s all expensive. I’m from a working class background. There’s no way I could have had my own go-cart and raced at weekends as a kid - we couldn’t have afforded it, let alone not having a garage in which to store it or a van/trailer to transport it between circuits. I’m aware there are some DIYers with sidecar outfits and the like over here who perhaps manage to race on a shoestring budget, but that is certainly not the norm in motorsport generally which is for white privileged folk in the main. 

You're assuming that black people always share the same aspirations, values and goals as the white and privileged. The fact is that many of them don't. We don't live in a mono-culture where everyone shares the same yardstick of success. Most black kids don't want to be the next Olympic swimming champion; the next Lewis Hamilton, or win an IOM TT. It's not primarily white privilege or class that's stopping them, so much as how they define status and success. Many black kids totally reject what they see as mainstream white culture and tradition.     

[The Dog's Dangly Bits]

1 hour ago, TheTeapot said:

I know this. You said there has never been a top class white male sprinter. He has individual olympic and world championship bronze medals, as well as european golds. You can't win an olympic medal of any kind without being 'top class'.

Never mind.

[Gladys]

1 hour ago, quilp said:

https://unherd.com/2020/06/cambridge-universitys-very-modern-bigotry/

A 5-minute read by Douglas Murray. I posted earlier about this woman, and the selective stance taken by Cambridge University regarding its policies on no-platforming academics who don't or won't toe the line. The MSM has been very quiet on this Doctor's divisive and racist statement, "White lives don't matter" and has given little coverage to the university's reaction and defence of this employee. A white person would be hung, drawn and quartered had the roles been reversed.

Edited to add: A petition raised on change.org, signed up to by 20,000+ people to have her sacked, has been removed by the website. In comparison, take the furore over the "White Lives Matter Burnley" banner, the 'perpetrators' get sacked from their jobs and publicly vilified with great fanfare yet this hateful racist Doctor gets promoted by the university...

I am often reminded of Ali G's "is it 'cos I is black?".  To which, more often than not the retort should be "no, it's because you are a dick.".