Gladys Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 9 minutes ago, Declan said: You have to wonder about that mental gymnastics that enabled people to see the humanitarian need for RNLI but not the abolition of slavery. TBH, there probably wasn't any need for mental gymnastics as the two issues most likely were viewed as completely separate with no hypocrisy. This was a time when views were generally quite unempathetic with any group of people who were in the "lower orders", be they black, poor, children of the poor, disabled, non-Christian and so on. We find child labour abhorrent, if not baffling, but the prevailing view was that as they were the offspring of poor, thus products of lazy, ungodly, immoral and dishonest people, so it was quite justifiable to send them up chimneys or into weaving looms. They deserved nothing better and it could be considered either a punishment or even an opportunity for redemption. Like I said, it is difficult for us to judge without understanding the generally accepted mores of the time. That is not to excuse, but to understand. It is also likely that the various social reformers from that time also held what we would consider hypocritical or inconsistent beliefs. That doesn't denigrate what they achieved, as a change in attitudes is a slow and incremental process. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 1 hour ago, FDR said: Fake News @TheTeapot has already responded and pointed out the utter Trumpian propaganda (or "proper-gander" to quote from an individual on facebook sharing very similar views as you). 43 minutes ago, Declan said: You have to wonder about that mental gymnastics that enabled people to see the humanitarian need for RNLI but not the abolition of slavery. All you need to do is take a look around at the moment. There are many people who appear to hold views on topical subjects that appear to be completely at odds with each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FDR Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 I found this very amusing: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piebaps Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Has Amadeus apologized for his country's conduct during ze var yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 9 minutes ago, piebaps said: Has Amadeus apologized for his country's conduct during ze var yet? He did make some reference to it in the early days of the debate. I can't remember if he apologised or not, but I am pretty sure he was not active between 1939 and 1945. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Kirby House in Braddan was built by Colonel Wilks on his retirement from the East India Company, although it stood empty whilst he went to St Helena as Governor. After his daughter Lady Laura Buchan moved out it was sold to George Drinkwater. He was a slave broker and plantation owner from Liverpool. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FDR Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 How can a person apologise for something they didn't do? How can a person accept an apology for something that wasn't done to them? These back and forths are pointless collectivist politics of the left. We should treat each other as individuals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 Just now, Gladys said: He did make some reference to it in the early days of the debate. I can't remember if he apologised or not, but I am pretty sure he was not active between 1939 and 1945. On behalf of which country? Our foreign correspondent has had stays in Philippines, Greece, Montenegro in recent years, as well as Bavaria and Mann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 (edited) 17 minutes ago, FDR said: How can a person apologise for something they didn't do? How can a person accept an apology for something that wasn't done to them? These back and forths are pointless collectivist politics of the left. We should treat each other as individuals. And how far does it extend..? Edited July 1, 2020 by quilp 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 12 minutes ago, FDR said: How can a person apologise for something they didn't do? How can a person accept an apology for something that wasn't done to them? These back and forths are pointless collectivist politics of the left. We should treat each other as individuals. It is also laying the ground for a redistribution of wealth, some would believe. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 12 minutes ago, John Wright said: On behalf of which country? Our foreign correspondent has had stays in Philippines, Greece, Montenegro in recent years, as well as Bavaria and Mann All of them! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 15 minutes ago, Gladys said: He did make some reference to it in the early days of the debate. I can't remember if he apologised or not, but I am pretty sure he was not active between 1939 and 1945. He has previously posted that the British should get over the war. (I'm paraphasing a more sophisticated point egregiously, but that was the message I took away). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 6 minutes ago, Declan said: He has previously posted that the British should get over the war. (I'm paraphasing a more sophisticated point egregiously, but that was the message I took away). Perhaps without the paraphrasing he had a point? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 32 minutes ago, FDR said: How can a person apologise for something they didn't do? How can a person accept an apology for something that wasn't done to them? These back and forths are pointless collectivist politics of the left. We should treat each other as individuals. Hi TJ, what back and forths? Who's (seriously) asking uninvolved people to apologise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted July 1, 2020 Share Posted July 1, 2020 15 hours ago, Gladys said: Yes, I always found that grave very poignant, not least because he died so young despite being held in such high regard and, therefore presumably, well looked after. There's some more information, including the full inscription, on this piece from when it was cleaned a few years back. The history of slavery in St Helena is fascinating in itself because of the very mixed nature of the population. There were attempts to mitigate it in various ways, but actual abolition didn't take place till 1834 with the rest of the British colonies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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