Spat between Chief Minister and Dr Glover

[Pipsqueak]

1 hour ago, Gladys said:

I thought the same.  But someone said PM is now attached to James Davis's outfit.  It will be interesting how challenging PM is in his questioning in future. 

 just like the guy wanting to build an abattoir at ellerslie to a do a  cost effective private job better than governmemt were doing with theirs ,  lots of negative noise against the abattoir right up to the point he was given a job there and then no shouting about a private abattoir at ellerslie ,  moulton has probably taken the kings shilling too.  inside the tent pissing out is usually the best option if the tax payers can afford it, or even if they can't 

[Gladys]

9 minutes ago, quilp said:

RG also gave a breakdown of the costs involved for the tests. Was it less than £25? The cost to the public was £50 or something like that? It did come up in the early days...

Yes, RG was supplying the reagents at cost  IIRC but government was making a turn.  

[The Voice of Reason]

58 minutes ago, TerryFuchwit said:

Or it could just be that David Ashford is actually enjoying the weekend with his family.  As he's entitled to do.

More than entitled to after all the hours he has put in and the vitriol he has had to endure. 

Who would begrudge him a couple of hours relaxing, enjoying Countryfile and Antiques Roadshow.

Happy Easter David. Don’t let the buggers get you down.

 

 

 

 

[quilp]

On 10/26/2020 at 8:12 AM, The Dog's Dangly Bits said:

This really kicked off over 7 day testing...

Perhaps the answer is for RG to tell everyone what should be happening that isn't? Rather than bleating about it.

Now look. 

[TerryFuchwit]

Hmmm. Well we've heard one side of the story that's for sure.

[the stinking enigma]

You haven't terence. You haven't listened to the pac thing. I know this for a fact

[quilp]

On 10/26/2020 at 2:26 PM, Roger Mexico said:

Probably not Public Health, who seem to be as little listened to as @rachomics, opposition is more likely to be from withing the DHSC hierarchy - especially from those with no medical or scientific qualifications of their own.  And also I suspect from those within the Cabinet Office especially Communications and External Affairs, who seem more interested in telling a 'good story' than whether it is actually true.

Spot on here Roger...

On 10/27/2020 at 12:05 PM, Dr. Grumpy said:

Hmm.... I had to look up Dr. Glover. As far as I can ascertain, she is not a medical doctor and does not have any relevant field expertise or experience in controlling a Pandemic. Also there's plenty of local experience and expertise in laboratory diagnosis of COVID-19. So I'm at a loss trying to understand why we think HQ should be listening to her rather than his Public Health and Infection control consultants. What am I missing here?

Have you now changed your tune Grumps..? 

On 10/27/2020 at 2:10 PM, wrighty said:

Without @rachomics on island PCR testing for covid would not have happened when it did, if at all. Of course, Rizwan Khan and Steve Doyle were vital too - sorry don’t know Dr Shields.

Truth.

On 10/27/2020 at 2:10 PM, wrighty said:

One reason Rachel needs to be involved in testing strategy discussions is logistics. She knows better than everyone how much we can do here, and how quickly etc. It’s no good someone announcing a mass-testing policy at borders, for example, if there’s been no discussion as to how it might or might not work. 

And again.

On 10/27/2020 at 6:52 PM, rachomics said:

Oh... I have my own thread on MF now. Not sure if that's good or bad or I've transcended into some kind of hell dimension. So much I could say about this thread but I think I'd need a gin first 

As @wrighty said, with all due respect to those named, you are incorrect. Rebbeca Shields (not a doc, a BMS), Steve Doyle and Rizwan Khan have all had their parts to play (and I love them lots because I've spent so much time with them over the last seven months they're almost family) but they didn't have the skills and experience to bring a professional high-throughput molecular diagnostics COVID19 lab (Lighthouse Lab equivalent) to the Isle of Man, which is to be expected given the size of the IoM! I wouldn't have been needed otherwise and I'm hoping some of my experience will have been passed on in the last seven months. 

It sounds like you work at the hospital but if you were to ask any of the lab staff (even in other areas like biochem or histopath) you'll get the answer that I was critical but just hid away in the lab during the outbreak working my ass off rather than telling every medic, nurse and HCA what I was doing there. Hospital staff know Bex, Steve and Rizwan, they didn't (and still don't) know me. To a lot of people who "popped in" to the microbiology office I would have just been another new face. The senior managers at DHSC didn't have a clue who I was or what I had done until about 2 weeks ago. 

 

On 10/27/2020 at 7:35 PM, rachomics said:

While I agree that all the inputs are very important, Rizwan, Steve and Bex tend to defer to me when it comes to how many samples we can process in the lab with the equipment we have. I used to run a UK government molecular diagnostics facility that tested 20k samples per week so they realise that I know a little bit about what I'm doing. 

 

On 10/27/2020 at 8:06 PM, rachomics said:

Absolutely, and I have blown the trumpet publicly many times about the microbiology team and how much they "stepped up" to take on testing that would normally not be anywhere near a hospital lab.

However, that testing would not have existed had I not sent an email to Steve Doyle back in March. The microbiology department would have, effectively, been a Post Office for sending samples to PHE in Manchester on a 3-day turnaround. If I were to walk away from the on-Island testing to concentrate on my business there would be no elective surgery, no endoscopy, and most hospital admissions would not be tested as they came through the door. I do think that is worthy of me "blowing my trumpet". The UK Government spent a hideous amount of money over 15 years training me to do what I can do and, ultimately, during COVID19 the IoM has been benefitting from that. 

Feel free to send me a PM, happy to meet with any DHSC staff in the canteen for a cuppa! 

 

On 10/27/2020 at 8:53 PM, wrighty said:

There probably would be, but it would be far more hamstrung than it already is.

 

On 10/27/2020 at 8:53 PM, wrighty said:

 Initially, UK Royal College guidance was for elective patients to test and then isolate for 14 days before retesting. We went somewhat ‘out on a limb’ and brought in a 3 day policy, given our covid-free status. This was not without regulatory difficulty. Consequently, at Noble’s we’ve had almost 3 months of near normal elective surgery. In Liverpool they managed a week. We couldn’t have done this without local testing and would probably have been bound to the 14 day rule initially, although interestingly the UK followed our lead and shifted to 3 day isolation.

 

On 10/27/2020 at 9:30 PM, rachomics said:

My personal grievance is with the system as a whole. I spent 15 years in DEFRA and I never saw anything like the inefficiency, number of jobsworths and backstabbing that I've seen in the IoM Government within the last 7 months. It's absolutely shocking but, if I'm honest, not entirely unexpected. 

And nothing's changed I'd wager...

On 10/28/2020 at 6:28 AM, Derek Flint said:

What we see here is the part that luck has played in our good fortune. Luck that we happened to have someone with Rachel’s expertise on Island when we did. Has anyone given a thought to where we might be right now if she hadn’t been here? I sincerely hope that in due course she gets some real recognition. Every now and then in a major operation, one person truly makes a difference. This woman is one such individual.

Well said, Del...

On 10/29/2020 at 1:51 PM, Roger Mexico said:

Well it's exactly what you would expect from them - and of course incredibly short-sighted as the science develops all the time.  She still hopes to be involved:

Of course one thing this has proved is that the politicians weren't telling the truth when they said she wasn't an employee, which tells you just how much they are being misinformed themselves (not that some of them seem to care).

And as RG stated in her answer to the Speaker's question when he asked that despite all the bollocks and mud-slinging that has gone on (I paraphrase), would she come back at the drop of a hat and with little hesitation the answer was an emphatic YES.

[TerryFuchwit]

19 minutes ago, the stinking enigma said:

You haven't terence. You haven't listened to the pac thing. I know this for a fact

Largely because I'm not a pensioner with nothing better to do for 3 hours stinky lad.  It's ok for you sat in your y fronts and Jim Royale style polo shirt with pencils up your nose etc but some of us are grafting away

Edited April 4, 2021 by TerryFuchwit

[the stinking enigma]

Well, at least you are honest mr fuchwit. On this occasion at least.

[the stinking enigma]

The voice of reason has listened to it though. And read the transcript. This i know for a fact too.

[the stinking enigma]

I wonder if he will be as honest.

[quilp]

On 10/30/2020 at 4:36 PM, jaymann said:

 

 

On 10/29/2020 at 3:57 PM, Gladys said:

There's a lot in a word and people who provide their services through a company do confuse the real contractual position.   If "she " has resigned, but in fact it is the company that has withdrawn its services, then there may be breach of contract issues.  

It will all come out in the wash, probably. 

The wash is definitely on 90 degrees now Gladys...

On 10/30/2020 at 2:18 PM, slinkydevil said:

I wonder who in the government media team wrote the:

"letter I've just recieved today actually from a member of the testing team."  David Ashford - press briefing.

And so it started.

On 10/30/2020 at 2:36 PM, Roger Mexico said:

It's classic Manx Civil Service isn't it?  What someone makes a criticism of how something works, instead of answering that or even altering the way you do things in response, you attack the critic personally for daring to suggest that anything you do could ever be wrong.  The fact that Ashford is stupid or weak enough to go along with it is not a good sign.

Not a good sign at all Roger.

On 10/30/2020 at 4:33 PM, Apple said:

These are not unusual behaviours from the DHSC in my view, knowing very well the people involved. The cover up this afternoon was laid on too thick - anonymous letters read out to the press, CM has long cover, DA reiterating the same points from the letter over and over again.

A very unprofessional approach...

On 10/30/2020 at 4:33 PM, Apple said:

If the believes that  Path lab and Microbiology are demoralised over this then where has he been for the last 3 years. 

The new approach to reading out complaints (Henderson) and letters from constituents /members of the public (August Hanson) in the last two Tynwald sessions (read it in Hansard) seem like some desperate attempts to show us how much they care but this is too little too late. But, now the precedents have been set, we can all send in anonymous letters,  complaints (of which there are now so many I reckon) and letters of concerns and expect them to be read out in Tynwald. And we as members of the public should now insist on it. Too many people dying under dubious circumstances.

Great post. 

On 10/30/2020 at 4:36 PM, jaymann said:

You have to love the Dr. She's got some cahoneys.

 

 Lol... 

[The Voice of Reason]

4 minutes ago, the stinking enigma said:

The voice of reason has listened to it though. And read the transcript. This i know for a fact too.

Did indeed listen to it.it. But did not read the transcript having no need to having listened to it.Is it I that you wonder will be as honest? As honest at what?

[2112]

54 minutes ago, The Voice of Reason said:

More than entitled to after all the hours he has put in and the vitriol he has had to endure. 

Who would begrudge him a couple of hours relaxing, enjoying Countryfile and Antiques Roadshow.

Happy Easter David. Don’t let the buggers get you down.

 

 

 

 

We vote these MHKs to work for the people, without fear or favour. We also shouldn’t expect ‘clock watchers’. It’s not a 9-5 job. You can be remunerated a basic amount and do a bare minimum as a MHK. Ashie wanted to be HRH The Chief Minister bag carrier and part of the club. You need resilience and a thick skin, and in this pandemic be prepared to work long hours for the same salary. Holidays and days off should be at the back of his mind .............  

Im sure the ‘great manx public’ would love to go on holiday ............... sadly we can’t. Also there are many of the ‘great manx public’ who are languishing on the hospital waiting lists. How many of them are to die because Ashie wants to relax on a Easter Sunday. A bit perverse really.

[Gladys]

Top work Quilp.