Roger Mexico Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 50 minutes ago, slinkydevil said: If you can stand watching it. As I keep on pointing out the thing about Ashford is that he does what he's told. Within that he's fairly diligent, careful and polite, but he's basically not much good at independent thought or standing up for himself or others. That's why he has that slightly aggrieved "I'm only following orders" tone all the time. Which is fine if you're some lowly underling, but not if you're Minister. In this case, some self-important PR wonk or other adviser has clearly come up with this daft 'idea' to discredit Dr Glover[1]. It's the sort of thing that would work with the London political press, but even our journalists treated it with the derision it deserves. Not only didn't Ashford have the nous or the will to stop it, he's forgotten the First Law of Holes and just keeps on repeating himself. Moulton isn't really much better because he is playing along with the line that this is all about claiming credit whereas @rachomics was concerned with how policy was being made (even Ashford seemed to have an idea of this). It is completely ridiculous that a Minister should read out an anonymous complaint about how the press is covering something and expect it to be taken seriously, but it's not really the important thing here. [1] Whether there was a real, unprompted email or not, I don't know. The story keeps changing slightly and it only seems to be from 'a member of DHSC staff', so it could just be the Deputy Assistant Head of Paperclips complaining that he hadn't been given a knighthood. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhumsaa Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 1 hour ago, slinkydevil said: If you can stand watching it. people in glass houses etc but.... is that the ultimate battle of hairstyles in denial? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 3 minutes ago, Rhumsaa said: I can't - is there a summary that cuts to the chase and avoids their voices? The captions facility works. It comes out as a babbling stream of consciousness spattered with 'um's, so it's fairly accurate. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhumsaa Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 1 hour ago, Lxxx said: Which is why, to be fair, we have elected officials. To hopefully push back on the unelected bureaucracy. However by having so many MHK's and paying them an average salary we have a job lot of average people who are ill suited to the job. Cut down the numbers, pay them a lot more and they may get people interested who are fit for purpose, who would otherwise be paid a lot more in the private sector. Those are the brains you want in them kind of positions. or not enough? so they're all so busy with their area that none of them can challenge or scrutiny properly? or they're all caught up somewhere so have to "play the game" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barlow Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 9 minutes ago, Rhumsaa said: people in glass houses etc but.... is that the ultimate battle of hairstyles in denial? He needs to go down to the wood and grow a big long beard. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhumsaa Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 1 minute ago, Barlow said: He needs to go down to the wood and grow a big long beard. it's a common look 3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenFairfax Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 39 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said: Moulton isn't really much better because he is playing along with the line that this is all about claiming credit whereas @rachomics was concerned with how policy was being made (even Ashford seemed to have an idea of this). Exactly, @rachomics said from start she felt "dissed" (as I would) that she was not consulted on testing policy. At end of day I am sure she does not (and really should not) really care what any of them think of her. Firstly, she is not looking for career in small rural hospital and secondly I doubt there is anyone on IoM other than her with background in genetic diagnosis who can make informed judgement. But all this is side show and main point is: If Dr Glover is not advising on testing policy and directing testing facility then WHO is? What he should have done today is try smooth things over.... Situation in UK changes each day and at least on my models I was expected another community outbreak by now. All he had to say is we are continuing to consult with Dr Glover and make use of her expertise in this area, and review testing facility policy going forward as events unfold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forestboy Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 Would someone please tie Moulton’s hands down. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uhtred Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 We’re really seeing the profound limitations of Ashford and Quayle now aren’t we? 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenFairfax Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, BenFairfax said: If Dr Glover is not advising on testing policy and directing testing facility then WHO is? We got a name today of person leading testing as: Dr Rizwan Khan from Chief Minister see: who as Dr Glover described on forum to us, and Dr Khan details in speech of 4 May 2020: https://www.gov.im/news/2020/may/04/dr-rizwan-khan-speech-4-may-2020/ set up "Manchester Public Health Laboratory for Reverse Transcriptase Polymerase Chain Reaction (RT-PCR) with a turnaround time ranging from 48-72 hours, depending on Manchester’s capacity." Issue is without Dr Glover input can we continue to under take locally PCR End-to-End testing with 24 hour turnaround. I am sure everyone in pathology is "doing a good job" and that was never issue, issue is are we going back to "48-72 hour" turnaround.... Under such a scenario how would tack and trace be able to function effectively in event of community outbreak? I do not know, but maybe Dr Glover or maybe even Dr Khan can let good people of IoM know.... Edited November 3, 2020 by BenFairfax Typo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 17 minutes ago, BenFairfax said: We got a name today of person leading testing as: Dr Rizwan Khan from Chief Minister see: who as Dr Glover described of forum to us, and Mr Khan details in speech of 4 May 2020: https://www.gov.im/news/2020/may/04/dr-rizwan-khan-speech-4-may-2020/ set up "Manchester Public Health Laboratory for Reverse Transcriptase Polymerase Chain Reaction (RT-PCR) with a turnaround time ranging from 48-72 hours, depending on Manchester’s capacity." Issue is without Dr Clover input can we continue to under take PCR End-to-End testing in 24 hours without sending samples to Manchester. I am sure everyone in pathology is "doing a good job" and that was never issue, issue is are we going back to "48-72 hour" turnaround.... Under such a scenario how would tack and trace be able to function effectively in event of community outbreak? I do not know, but maybe Dr Glover or maybe even Mr Khan can let good people of IoM know.... Dr Khan’s input and participation has been known from day 1. Given who he is and the position he occupies. He’s the Consultant Microbiologist/Director of Infection Control at Nobles. Did Dr Khan make a speech? Well sort of, that was his contribution to the Press Briefing on 4th May. So we’ve all known since then, very publicly. Not sure what you mean by “set up “ Manchester...”. He didn’t set up Manchester Public Health Laboratory. It’s not what that says. He’s here. That’s where we sent our swabs initially. That’s why they took 48-72 hours. Getting there! Once the fact we had the equipment here was recognised and @rachomics helped set it up, we were analysing locally. The machine is here, always operated in Manx public health laboratories, by Manx public health/path lab technicians. Why do you think that will close down and make us go back to shipping samples off island, to Manchester, or anywhere else? 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhumsaa Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 25 pages in but.... does anyone else keep misreading the title of this thread as spaff not spat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesultanofsheight Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, forestboy said: Would someone please tie Moulton’s hands down. If he’s not careful HQ will do that. Shortly before he’s slung in the harbour tethered to a brick. Edited November 3, 2020 by thesultanofsheight 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrighty Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 50 minutes ago, John Wright said: Why do you think that will close down and make us go back to shipping samples off island, to Manchester, or anywhere else? It won’t, but without Rachel’s input and availability to troubleshoot it’s far less resilient a service. I can see how we might get delays and have to ship tests across if, for example, we don’t have the reagents that she makes up. I certainly hope she comes to an agreement with the DHSC and continues. 9 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted November 3, 2020 Share Posted November 3, 2020 43 minutes ago, Rhumsaa said: 25 pages in but.... does anyone else keep misreading the title of this thread as spaff not spat? No, only you. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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