TT 2022 ??

[HeliX]

3 hours ago, Bandits said:

Agree there - it’s hard to see how someone so throughly woke supports the continuation of people being allowed to smash themselves into walls at 150mph. 

Only because you've let tabloids tell you what woke means. Thinking people should be allowed to live their lives how they want to, without interference from those who don't like it, is entirely consistent with supporting the TT. 

[AOR]

2 hours ago, Derek Flint said:

The world is looking in on this.

Except it isn't is it.

The BBC do report, the Daily Mail sensationalise.

But not the world.

The world can't be arsed anymore to report on wars where 1000s are  maimed and killed. Johnny fucking Depp and Amber thingummy are all I see these days.

 

Edited June 7, 2022 by AOR

[HeliX]

2 hours ago, Lost Login said:

So you would support people being able to settle arguments by duelling, legalising the most addictful and harmful drugs, legalising the mass ownership of guns, including automatic weapons, 

I am generally in favour of personal freedoms but it is not unlimited and I accept that it reasonable to put limits in place on certain activities or that Government should not assist or promote some activities which legal are potentially harmful. This is especially the case where the public are left picking up the tab when things go wrong, e.g. medical care or are otherwise negatively impacted e.g. cancellation & delays in treatment at Nobles whilst the hospital gears up to handle crashes etc.

I agree with personal freedom but I think that it is balanced by personal responsibility

Duelling, eh - maybe. I could probably be convinced if you could guarantee nobody was being coerced. I'm in favour of decriminalising all drugs, legalising cannabis (and probably ket + mdma) and using the revenue to help people who take hard drugs with rehab. Ownership of guns impacts the safety of other non-consenting people pretty dramatically, so no.

The medical tab for the TT will be considerably smaller than the medical tab for people eating "wrongly"... I don't think that means we should prevent either of those things. Though we should make the TT safer and help people to make better food choices.

[Lxxx]

2 hours ago, Derek Flint said:

The third fatality was on BBC news this morning. After 2 years off, it does seem very stark, especially in the light of new safety plans and systems. For example, All the digital red flag seems to be is an arse covering exercise for the Tower. 

The world is looking in on this.

I think you are giving the island too much credit. They are just filling column inches. Hardly anyone in the world knows where we are let alone gives a shit about what goes on here. 

[WTF]

Just now, Lxxx said:

I think you are giving the island too much credit. They are just filling column inches. Hardly anyone in the world knows where we are let alone gives a shit about what goes on here. 

certainly not the FSC.

[Zarley]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/othersports/article-10883417/At-age-50-John-McGuinness-relishing-100th-Isle-Man-TT-start.html 9

McGuinness on the aftermath of his 2017 crash at the NW200:

‘I lost 52mm from my leg,’ he says. ‘They put it in a (fixator) cage and I had to grow it back 1mm a day, so I had to keep using a spanner to unlock the brace every day so it would grow. It wasn’t fun. Even when you get your leg over the missus you would boot her in the shin with a 5kg cage on your leg.’

And yet he's still racing.

I hate that competitors die during the TT and MGP (or whatever other names they have for the August racing).

It obviously can and should be made safer - but in an increasingly risk-adverse world I think it should continue. These people do it because they love it. They're not forced to do it. 

For the record, I'm not a fan. I've watched one race in over 30 years, just so I could say I've done it. But I "get it". I rode for a bit in my youth and I did some pretty crazy, dangerous things on that Yamaha 500 on rural, little-used back roads. While I wouldn't do such things today, I'd be pretty damn pissed off if someone had prevented me from having that experience and having those wonderful memories. My body, my life, my choice . 

[HeliX]

2 hours ago, 2112 said:

According to todays Examiner there will be no Mad Sunday as such and Senior Race Day will be on the following Day (Saturday). Presumably it’s to try and beat the weather and allow more practice time  and to start the racing on Mad Sunday or to squeeze more money into the event and economy. I bet this won’t go down well and people will be unhappy at losing the Senior Race Day off. 

Mad Sunday is the Sunday between practice and race week. It hasn't been "mad" Sunday for ages, it's the legacy lap day.

[Happier diner]

2 hours ago, Lost Login said:

So you would support people being able to settle arguments by duelling, legalising the most addictful and harmful drugs, legalising the mass ownership of guns, including automatic weapons, 

I am generally in favour of personal freedoms but it is not unlimited and I accept that it reasonable to put limits in place on certain activities or that Government should not assist or promote some activities which legal are potentially harmful. This is especially the case where the public are left picking up the tab when things go wrong, e.g. medical care or are otherwise negatively impacted e.g. cancellation & delays in treatment at Nobles whilst the hospital gears up to handle crashes etc.

I agree with personal freedom but I think that it is balanced by personal responsibility

Yes there is a difference between personal freedom and the expectation that someone has to provide a platform for you to live that freedom. We host the race and riders are free to enter. If we didn't they would have the freedom to do something else. Therefore in my view, 'personal freedom' has no part in the debate.

[Lost Login]

5 minutes ago, HeliX said:

Duelling, eh - maybe. I could probably be convinced if you could guarantee nobody was being coerced. I'm in favour of decriminalising all drugs, legalising cannabis (and probably ket + mdma) and using the revenue to help people who take hard drugs with rehab. Ownership of guns impacts the safety of other non-consenting people pretty dramatically, so no.

The medical tab for the TT will be considerably smaller than the medical tab for people eating "wrongly"... I don't think that means we should prevent either of those things. Though we should make the TT safer and help people to make better food choices.

The TT impacts none consenting people pretty dramatically as well. e.g. cancellation of hospital appointments.

The government prevent many foods being sold after set dates as it may be bad for us. They actively discourage and educate against poor diets. With regard the TT they actively encourage a dangerous event. I struggle to think of any thing else that the Government actively promote and encourage that has a reasonably high level of risk and danger and that is where I see the difference.

If people who enjoy riding motorbikes and racing them want to carry on doing so then fine, crack on as far as I am concerned. Organise themselves, do it on private property, do it in a safe way etc. I don't really care. I just don't believe it should be stated sponsored.

With regard to your medical tab argument then I believe you are incorrect. The medical tab per person I expect is far larger for the TT than for "people eating wrongly"   

  

 

 

[HeliX]

1 minute ago, Lost Login said:

The TT impacts none consenting people pretty dramatically as well. e.g. cancellation of hospital appointments.

The government prevent many foods being sold after set dates as it may be bad for us. They actively discourage and educate against poor diets. With regard the TT they actively encourage a dangerous event. I struggle to think of any thing else that the Government actively promote and encourage that has a reasonably high level of risk and danger and that is where I see the difference.

If people who enjoy riding motorbikes and racing them want to carry on doing so then fine, crack on as far as I am concerned. Organise themselves, do it on private property, do it in a safe way etc. I don't really care. I just don't believe it should be stated sponsored.

With regard to your medical tab argument then I believe you are incorrect. The medical tab per person I expect is far larger for the TT than for "people eating wrongly"   

  

 

 

You're right about cancellation of hospital appointments, that should be addressed using some of the funds from the TT.

The Govt actively encourages those taking part in the TT to do so safely (nay, requires it to some extent - required signatures from other road race events, newcomer lap, insurance, safety equipment). 

Per person the tab might be larger for the TT, except that most of the TT competitors don't wind up needing treatment. Most of the population will.

[Lost Login]

31 minutes ago, HeliX said:

Thinking people should be allowed to live their lives how they want to, without interference from those who don't like it, is entirely consistent with supporting the TT. 

So men should be allowed to masturbate in public in front of women and children? I don't believe they should but preventing them means you are interfering with living their lives "how they want to, without interference from those who don't like it".  

[Lost Login]

1 minute ago, HeliX said:

You're right about cancellation of hospital appointments, that should be addressed using some of the funds from the TT.

The Govt actively encourages those taking part in the TT to do so safely (nay, requires it to some extent - required signatures from other road race events, newcomer lap, insurance, safety equipment). 

Per person the tab might be larger for the TT, except that most of the TT competitors don't wind up needing treatment. Most of the population will.

If competitors were taking part in the TT safely they would not end up in a morgue or critically ill in hospital

[cissolt]

3 minutes ago, HeliX said:

You're right about cancellation of hospital appointments, that should be addressed using some of the funds from the TT.

The Govt actively encourages those taking part in the TT to do so safely (nay, requires it to some extent - required signatures from other road race events, newcomer lap, insurance, safety equipment). 

Per person the tab might be larger for the TT, except that most of the TT competitors don't wind up needing treatment. Most of the population will.

You assume that the TT is profitable for the government and therefore has money to spent on health.  It's not profitable, the outlay for this TT will eclipse anything that has gone before.

[HeliX]

6 minutes ago, Lost Login said:

So men should be allowed to masturbate in public in front of women and children? I don't believe they should but preventing them means you are interfering with living their lives "how they want to, without interference from those who don't like it".  

Did you think this was a sensible argument and valid comparison when you typed it?

[HeliX]

3 minutes ago, Lost Login said:

If competitors were taking part in the TT safely they would not end up in a morgue or critically ill in hospital

Why not? It's a dangerous activity. Lots of sports where you can take good safety measures you can still end up critically ill or dead. Doesn't mean those safety measures haven't been taken.