Happier diner Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 15 minutes ago, Banker said: The police have mentioned they came off cycle tracks but must have been aware of TT & rules, anyway ignorance of law is no defense! Key question. We're they locals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiVibes Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 1 hour ago, Roger Mexico said: My immediate reaction wasn't just "How stupid!" but "How did they do that?". The problem is the Police and how they have announced this, they have fueled the anti-cyling rhetoric needlessly, it just sounds like a couple of guys probably TT fans out on MTB trails that took a brief diversion on a closed road and thus were no threat to anyone but the way it has been reported really has fuelled the usual drama queens on here and facebook. The actions of these cyclists is dangerous for the cyclists themselves and other road users, not only for them to be cycling on the Mountain Road, but also cycling against the one way system, had the mountain road been opened at the conclusion of the incident and they hadn’t been stopped So it was a closed road ie no road users and no danger, and then a lot of ifs and buts about what could have happened if the road was open, which it wasn't. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bandits Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 2 minutes ago, HiVibes said: The problem is the Police and how they have announced this, they have fueled the anti-cyling rhetoric needlessly, it just sounds like a couple of guys probably TT fans out on MTB trails that took a brief diversion on a closed road and thus were no threat to anyone but the way it has been reported really has fuelled the usual drama queens on here and facebook. The actions of these cyclists is dangerous for the cyclists themselves and other road users, not only for them to be cycling on the Mountain Road, but also cycling against the one way system, had the mountain road been opened at the conclusion of the incident and they hadn’t been stopped So it was a closed road ie no road users and no danger, and then a lot of ifs and buts about what could have happened if the road was open, which it wasn't. When they’ve just fined a bloke two grand for walking on the course. So there is potentially eight grand there but as usual the lycra louts will get let off because of our silly obsession with active travel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shake me up Judy Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 1 hour ago, Passing Time said: Best post so far in this thread... No it's not. Maybe it's you guys who don't get it. I've grown up with the T.T. since I was a young lad in the early '60s. Don't think that for a moment I don't get it. I respect Roxanne's opinions on many topics but she's dead wrong on this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Ship Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 20 hours ago, kevster said: They are covered. Each competitor must have a certain level of insurance inplace. See the regulations (section 4) https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/iom-tt-races-2022/tt_regulations_2022_v11-1_compressed.pdf Perhaps I'm misreading the regulations, but if I understand them correctly, then the "certain level of insurance" could barely be described as sufficient, let alone adequate. Are the levels of benefit referred to in sections 4.1 and 4.7 the only cover for death or disablement that a rider needs in order to be allowed to compete? If so, then the amounts seem wholly inadequate and I'd be inclined to agree with Chinahand that the races are being run with insurance cover that woefully understates the potential true costs of the risks being run. Am I completely misunderstanding the minimum insurance cover requirement? (I had wondered if riders might be covered by the ACU's third party public liability insurance, but looking at the ACU Handbook I don't think they are?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiVibes Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 9 minutes ago, Bandits said: When they’ve just fined a bloke two grand for walking on the course. So there is potentially eight grand there but as usual the lycra louts will get let off because of our silly obsession with active travel. The guy crossed the road when it was closed for racing. This is not the same thing at all. I don't doubt they broke the law but the Police making this a big issue when it was putting no one at risk is just as silly and pointless as your frothy mouthed angry fat man posts. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 TT safety etc being reported on BBC news channel shortly just announced Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bandits Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 13 minutes ago, Roxanne said: He was fined for walking on a road closed for racing. The cyclists were on a road closed to all traffic. It's not the same. What they did was wrong but it's not comparable to your example. It’s completely comparable and actually has the potential to be more dangerous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Ship Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Max Power said: [Edited: Wrong post quoted] 2 hours ago, Lost Login said: ... I simply can not comprehend enjoying something so much that I would be prepared to accept that level of risk. As I said I would simply compute and think that I would mitigate the risk and that it would not happen to me until it did. When I hear the phrase "they knew the risks" possibly incorrectly, I think did they really think they applied to them or just it was something that happens to others... Unfortunately I think a lot of riders simply don't understand the risks and/or think the risks don't apply to them. I'm not suggesting they're stupid or anything, just that I think there's a natural tendency for people to underestimate the dangers and risks inherent in activities that they enjoy. 2 hours ago, Lost Login said: ... It is therefore very informative to ask the question to somebody who unfortunately been through it. The rest of us really have no idea if told the outcome of doing X is Y whether we would still want to do X or find something else. I am also sure it is important to have a very positive attitude after an incident as if I had a family member who had died it would give a certain level of solace to think that they would do it all over again even if they knew what would happen because of the enjoyment they got rather than to think they would never have done it had they known Unfortunately it's not possible to ask those riders who didn't survive whether it was worth it. I also sometimes wonder - and I know this is going to sound awful to many people - whether riders who have survived accidents (or surviving relatives of riders who have been killed in accidents) unconsciously have a greater emotional investment in the event and are therefore more likely to continue supporting it than the evidence justifies. (Although I'd have to say Max Power's views on all this are actually very balanced and are obviously sincerely held.) Edited June 7, 2022 by Ghost Ship Deleted wrong post quoted 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annoymouse Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 4 minutes ago, HiVibes said: The guy crossed the road when it was closed for racing. This is not the same thing at all. I don't doubt they broke the law but the Police making this a big issue when it was putting no one at risk is just as silly and pointless as your frothy mouthed angry fat man posts. This happens almost every single time there is a red flag incident and people are stuck for hours on end with no updates, yesterday it took almost two hours to open the roads after they had announced racing had ended due to red flag and would be moved to a 6.30pm start, all for a racing incident on the mountain that remains shut between 5-6pm anyway, so why weren’t the roads open any earlier than 4.40pm? The Norwegian fella played the innocent card, worst thing he could’ve done because he has now been made a lesson out of. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Ship Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 2 hours ago, Max Power said: I've played rugby and competed in several sports where risk is involved, I have no real compunction to get involved in any again, even if I could. Even racing motorcycles elsewhere was only a means to allow me to race on the Mountain, as I say, there's nothing at all like it. The adrenaline certainly plays a part, but overall it's the challenge which draws you back, trying to do it better. It would be easy to say I'd do it when younger, knowing the outcome if it happened at 28 or something. The answer is, I don't know. I'd probably try to do a deal with myself to mitigate the risk? Thanks. That's an honest and sincere answer to a difficult question. (I meant to quote this post of yours in my previous post, but quoted the wrong one!) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bandits Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 28 minutes ago, HiVibes said: I don't doubt they broke the law but the Police making this a big issue when it was putting no one at risk is just as silly and pointless as your frothy mouthed angry fat man posts. You sound especially frothy mouthed and angry to be honest. Do you also assume that people who don’t agree with cyclists are fat? That says much more about you than me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passing Time Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 41 minutes ago, Shake me up Judy said: No it's not. Maybe it's you guys who don't get it. I've grown up with the T.T. since I was a young lad in the early '60s. Don't think that for a moment I don't get it. I respect Roxanne's opinions on many topics but she's dead wrong on this. as wrong as you? I too have grown up with the TT since the early 60's and enjoyed every year. I do not enjoy any of the accidents, but that doesn't give people the right to determine what grown men choose to do. I have lost a couple of friends to the TT and in every case, the family don't hold a grudge against the event. Maybe a few of the anti TT brigade on here should sit down over a coffee and have a chat with the families Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passing Time Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 32 minutes ago, Roxanne said: He was fined for walking on a road closed for racing. The cyclists were on a road closed to all traffic. It's not the same. What they did was wrong but it's not comparable to your example. Anyway - instead of forcing your innacturate judgements - why not just wait for the facts to be revealed. I know - shock horror. I wouldn't hold you breath on that Roxie, you'd need a couple of divers air tanks... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passing Time Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 20 minutes ago, Bandits said: It’s completely comparable and actually has the potential to be more dangerous. Have you started drinking extra early today? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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