Sheldon Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 38 minutes ago, wrighty said: Too strong for here, evidently. Lifetime ban do you reckon too? The first bit wasn't really banworthy, although it was beginning to get there, but then it went all UPPERCASE AND SHOUTY AND TURNED THE GRAPHIC DESCRIPTIONS UP TO 11, so who knows? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 5 minutes ago, Sheldon said: The first bit wasn't really banworthy, although it was beginning to get there, but then it went all UPPERCASE AND SHOUTY AND TURNED THE GRAPHIC DESCRIPTIONS UP TO 11, so who knows? I was massively offended by the typeface. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passing Time Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 minute ago, HeliX said: I was massively offended by the typeface. Thankfully, I missed it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joebean Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 (edited) The Alf Cannan interview is a great example of a politician avoiding the difficult and unpalatable short answer, in favour of a supposedly balanced and comprehensive response that totally misses the point of the question. Well done Alf, if that is what you intended. The line that he takes with the need to wait for a full investigation and the full facts of the incidents to be established before commenting is, of course completely spurious. Death is death; it is final and no review of the circumstances in which it happened is ever going to bring the deceased back to life. We have learned already, over many years and many deaths that racing on roads on the Isle of Man is going to lead to deaths. Every year. The fact is that every year the Government of the Isle of Man facilitates and funds the races, an average of over 2 competitors will die as a result. We need no investigation before commenting on that. It is a fact. If a decision needs to be made about safety and morality, it can be based on that existing and irrefutable fact. Alf contradicts himself. First, he says that all steps will be taken to improve safety, as a result of the investigation and recommendations arising from the latest incidents; shortly after he stresses that racing motorcycles on closed roads here is inherently dangerous. Yes, it is and it will always be so. The only recommendation that can reduce future fatalities to zero is to stop the races. Will Alf consider that recommendation? I sense not. This leads to the second contradictory statement, that no death is acceptable. It obviously is because the only recommendation that would prevent deaths in an "inherently dangerous" race, that is to stop facilitating it, is not going to be considered. We can conclude from this that some deaths ARE acceptable. If the Government runs the TT on behalf of the people of the Isle of Man, as Alf says, should we not find out what the people want the Government to do on their behalf? This is a serious moral issue. What better subject for a referendum? I suspect the result of such a referendum would be the continuation of the races as the majority of the people are accustomed to the death and, like the Government, have a tolerance of it. Given that, there is nothing to lose CM. Let's do it. Finally, the CM lays bare the moral compromise that lies at the centre of the TT. Despite the tragic deaths (which are tragic but expected, so probably not tragic but unfortunate) the TT was a "great success". Again, we show that a contribution to around 2% of GDP is worth; in 2022, 5 lives lost. They knew the risks; we knew what their lives were worth in filthy lucre. Roll on TT2023. From body bags we grow money bags; it's a great deal for the IOM. Edited June 16, 2022 by joebean 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopek Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 Alf referred to spectators witnessing................. So he knows but we plebs have to wait for the various 'inquiries'??? A glimmer of hope could be, in politician speak anyway, that this year has not been acceptable, just maybe, some behind the scenes discussion will take place to mitigate the appearance that we don't care as long as the 30 mil keeps rolling in? Is it all in place to drag this out until we have forgotten it??? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 14 minutes ago, joebean said: Alf contradicts himself. First, he says that all steps will be taken to improve safety, as a result of the investigation and recommendations arising from the latest incidents; shortly after he stresses that racing motorcycles on closed roads here is inherently dangerous. Yes, it is and it will always be so. The only recommendation that can reduce future fatalities to zero is to stop the races. Will Alf consider that recommendation? I sense not. This leads to the second contradictory statement, that no death is acceptable. It obviously is because the only recommendation that would prevent deaths in an "inherently dangerous" race, that is to stop facilitating it, is not going to be considered. We can conclude from this that some deaths ARE acceptable. Neither of those statements are contradictions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopek Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 .....but they are 'politician speak'. Sound good, say nothing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 Just now, Kopek said: .....but they are 'politician speak'. Sound good, say nothing! I thought he gave fairly reasonable responses to fairly unreasonable questions from an interviewer who wasn't listening and was interrupting. 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kopek Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 (edited) Helix, I think on a different subject you would recognise politicians responses? Edited June 16, 2022 by Kopek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 9 minutes ago, Kopek said: Helix, I think on a different subject you would recognise politicians responses? I notice Paul Moulton's terrible questions on most topics. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joebean Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 18 minutes ago, HeliX said: Neither of those statements are contradictions. I take it that logic is not your thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 2 minutes ago, joebean said: I take it that logic is not your thing. I'm fine with logic. You appear not to be fine with nuance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhumsaa Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 2 hours ago, alpha-acid said: He should he was one of them could be anyone mate 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joebean Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 10 minutes ago, Youaintseenme said: Explain how Alf contradicts himself. Really? I just wrote a number of paragraphs doing that. Take off the rose-tinted specs and put on your reading ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 minute ago, joebean said: Really? I just wrote a number of paragraphs doing that. Take off the rose-tinted specs and put on your reading ones. How many deaths on normal open roads are acceptable? How many deaths from covid are acceptable? The reason Alf quite deliberately said "acceptable, in inverted commas" is that he recognised it was a shithead question for shitheads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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