TT 2022 ??

[The Phantom]

23 minutes ago, manxman1980 said:

Wingsuit Flying - 1 death per 500 jumps.  More than 400 people have died since 1981.

There are most definitely sport activities that carry considerably more risk than the TT.

Mountaineers on K2.  Approximately 1 person dies per 5 people summiting! 

[The Phantom]

1 minute ago, Youaintseenme said:

There are several sports with death and injury rates not much different to the TT but pointing them out is pointless to people who can’t see past their own opinion that it must be banned.

BASE jumpers rely on a single canopy with no reserve parachute. Estimates of injury rate are 0.2-0.4% per jump [2,3] and fatality rates of 0.04% per jump or 1.7% per participant per year [3, 4] , suggesting that this is one of the most dangerous sporting activities.

Indeed.  You don't get old wingsuiters/base jumpers.

You're either old or bold, not both. 

[Roger Mexico]

9 minutes ago, manxman1980 said:

Wingsuit Flying - 1 death per 500 jumps.  More than 400 people have died since 1981.

There are most definitely sport activities that carry considerably more risk than the TT.

I suspect you got the information from this source which states:

Even BASE jumping is unavoidably dangerous. The list of deaths grows every month. There are many accidents every year, and practically all of them are fatal.

Since 1981, more than 400 people have died, many of them during wingsuit flights. The death rate for wingsuiting is an astonishing 1 death per 500 jumps.

So the 400 deaths is for all BASE jumping, not just wingsuits (as usual 'the headline is always wrong').  This NG article from 2019 provides some interesting context.

Of course saying that something is marginally safer than throwing yourself, isn't really a great advert for it anyway.

[WTF]

how dangerous would the TT be if it was on mount everest ??????   fucking hell !!!!!!

[paswt]

2 hours ago, Happier diner said:

That's the view from Onchan

The houses you see are  "in" Onchan and pay Onchan Rates , but don't let the facts put you off posting inaccurate  information .

Hope this helps

[Happier diner]

23 minutes ago, paswt said:

The houses you see are  "in" Onchan and pay Onchan Rates , but don't let the facts put you off posting inaccurate  information .

Hope this helps

It was just a joke

[Happier diner]

It might be an unpopular thing to say

But death does not cost the NHS anything much

[manxman1980]

5 hours ago, Roger Mexico said:

I suspect you got the information from this source which states:

Even BASE jumping is unavoidably dangerous. The list of deaths grows every month. There are many accidents every year, and practically all of them are fatal.

Since 1981, more than 400 people have died, many of them during wingsuit flights. The death rate for wingsuiting is an astonishing 1 death per 500 jumps.

So the 400 deaths is for all BASE jumping, not just wingsuits (as usual 'the headline is always wrong').  This NG article from 2019 provides some interesting context.

Of course saying that something is marginally safer than throwing yourself, isn't really a great advert for it anyway.

Rog it doesn't really matter as either way it is an activity that carries risk comparable or worse than the TT.

[Kopek]

To the individuals involved there is nothing worse than death!

For the surviving relatives................

[Expat.]

23 hours ago, Capt_Mainwaring said:

Oh yes I understand the scale is different. The TT is what though, a few days in total? If it was happening all summer, does that make a difference? I don't know. Just trying to rationalise it in my head. Is one death too many? Could you apply that to any pastime where death could result? 

No, for what it's worth, I don't think you can say that one death is too many given that humans are irredeemably stupid and can manage to kill themselves in just about every activity you could think of. Somebody, somewhere, tomorrow will somehow contrive to kill themselves putting their trousers on. We tend to write these events off and try not to laugh. Humans also like to engage in activities that put themselves at clearer risk. Hundreds of examples have been listed on this thread. Statisticians would be interested in working out how many fatalities occur out of a thousand people undertaking the activity, the bigger the number the greater the degree of risk. Riding motorcycles carries a risk, racing motorcycles carries a greater degree of risk, racing motorcycles on the Isle of Man carries a still greater degree of risk.

Authorities are reluctant to limit their citizens freedoms but they do from time to time when there is an agreement that an activity is just too dangerous. Base jumping has been mentioned because it is insanely dangerous and the Aussies have severely restricted it because some poor bugger has to struggle to some god forsaken backwater to retrieve the bits.

What's interesting is the absolute fury the 'discussion' generates here and elsewhere. It would need a stronger government than yours or mine to sort it out. Is the problem that the mountain circuit was a good test of man and machine back in the days when it started, but now the machines are so powerful, the margins for error so slight and the impacts of chance so great that the course needs to be radically re engineered?

[Gizo]

8 hours ago, Youaintseenme said:

There are several sports with death and injury rates not much different to the TT but pointing them out is pointless to people who can’t see past their own opinion that it must be banned.

BASE jumpers rely on a single canopy with no reserve parachute. Estimates of injury rate are 0.2-0.4% per jump [2,3] and fatality rates of 0.04% per jump or 1.7% per participant per year [3, 4] , suggesting that this is one of the most dangerous sporting activities.

Yeah but how many burgers did they sell?

[Max Power]

3 hours ago, Expat. said:

What's interesting is the absolute fury the 'discussion' generates here and elsewhere. It would need a stronger government than yours or mine to sort it out. Is the problem that the mountain circuit was a good test of man and machine back in the days when it started, but now the machines are so powerful, the margins for error so slight and the impacts of chance so great that the course needs to be radically re engineered?

That's an argument that's been raging since 1911 following the death of 19 year old Victor Surridge. Safety has improved dramatically, but so have the speeds. At least one of the fatalities this year didn't actually strike anything other than the road when he came off his machine. 

Edited July 1, 2022 by Max Power

[Gizo]

6 hours ago, Max Power said:

At least one of the fatalities this year didn't actually strike anything other than the road when he came off his machine. 

Phew. That’s alright then. 
nothing to see here. 

[Non-Believer]

11 hours ago, Expat. said:

Is the problem that the mountain circuit was a good test of man and machine back in the days when it started, but now the machines are so powerful, the margins for error so slight and the impacts of chance so great that the course needs to be radically re engineered?

The course is what it is and can't or doesn't need to be re-engineered...it's public commuter roads for 95% of the year (in better condition than any other roads on the Island).

What we have is the horses for courses argument and the problem is that we've evolved into currently using horses that were designed for other, different courses.

Of course those horses now make the event particularly spectacular and that's a great thing when you've got coffers being drained by remarkable salary and pension liabilities. But when it goes wrong, the harder that you throw frail human bodies into solid immovable objects, the greater and more horrific the outcome, particularly when it involves innocent spectators and bystanders.

[Max Power]

7 hours ago, Gizo said:

Phew. That’s alright then. 
nothing to see here. 

That's not what I meant, I was trying to illustrate that not all accidents with a fatal outcome are due to the course itself, nor the surrounding architecture. It is possible to be killed or seriously injured just by doing exactly what you would have done at a short circuit with all the safety enhancements in place.