John Wright Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 The problem is that the current structure doesn’t identify or resolve the issues. The new structure will have much more information gathering and processing to discover what the issues are. That involves extra staff. But we know what the real issues are already. Passenger throughput/footfall is too small to derive a worthwhile income from non flying spend. They seem, perhaps subconsciously, to try to keep us holed up in departures for longer in the forlorn hope we might spend more. The report actually identifies the basic need, to get passengers in/out of the Island efficiently and relatively pleasantly ( no airport is a pleasant experience for most “coach” or budget passengers. It doesn’t seek to address that. what makes IoM airport particularly unpleasant. 1. security. It’s essential we get one of the advanced scanners so there’s no more 100ml limit, plastic bags, remove and same for pda/phones/laptops. That should smooth flow. 2. Ensure planes land and take off on time. That’s sub divided. ATC. Recruit/train/retain sufficient numbers and have proper succession planning in place. Should never have come to this. If they have to then pay over the odds. End of runway light gantries. This needs reestablishing. Guidance systems. We have a renewed ILS. Install a GPS system ( I know there may be EU licensing issues and cost - but Jersey got there ). Reduce minima to 400, not 800 feet. These are quick fixes, but depend on airline operators installing the right equipment in their planes. Not sure that changing the CAT system level is economic or that most operators ( of small planes ) would invest. 3. Sort out the RinGo system. Get rid. Do something simple and successful that doesn’t have a non responsive off Island operator taking a cut. Outside of those three almost everything else is fiddling whilst Rome burns. There are other things. Improve the ambulift provision. A proper changing facility with hoists, adult size on both land side and airside. Adjust the seating in the downstairs departure holding lounge so the seats don’t slope forwards. They are horribly uncomfortable. How do we pay for this? £5.00 airport use charge on every ticket. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 28 minutes ago, John Wright said: The problem is that the current structure doesn’t identify or resolve the issues. The new structure will have much more information gathering and processing to discover what the issues are. That involves extra staff. But we know what the real issues are already. Passenger throughput/footfall is too small to derive a worthwhile income from non flying spend. They seem, perhaps subconsciously, to try to keep us holed up in departures for longer in the forlorn hope we might spend more. The report actually identifies the basic need, to get passengers in/out of the Island efficiently and relatively pleasantly ( no airport is a pleasant experience for most “coach” or budget passengers. It doesn’t seek to address that. what makes IoM airport particularly unpleasant. 1. security. It’s essential we get one of the advanced scanners so there’s no more 100ml limit, plastic bags, remove and same for pda/phones/laptops. That should smooth flow. 2. Ensure planes land and take off on time. That’s sub divided. ATC. Recruit/train/retain sufficient numbers and have proper succession planning in place. Should never have come to this. If they have to then pay over the odds. End of runway light gantries. This needs reestablishing. Guidance systems. We have a renewed ILS. Install a GPS system ( I know there may be EU licensing issues and cost - but Jersey got there ). Reduce minima to 400, not 800 feet. These are quick fixes, but depend on airline operators installing the right equipment in their planes. Not sure that changing the CAT system level is economic or that most operators ( of small planes ) would invest. 3. Sort out the RinGo system. Get rid. Do something simple and successful that doesn’t have a non responsive off Island operator taking a cut. Outside of those three almost everything else is fiddling whilst Rome burns. There are other things. Improve the ambulift provision. A proper changing facility with hoists, adult size on both land side and airside. Adjust the seating in the downstairs departure holding lounge so the seats don’t slope forwards. They are horribly uncomfortable. How do we pay for this? £5.00 airport use charge on every ticket. I would be happy to pay more via airport/landing fee but I can imagine many people will just complain & demand subsidised fares to get off island 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Onchan Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 I still can't believe that they are seriously looking to go ahead with corporatization. It's an admission that they can't fix relatively easy operational issues and have given up and the "hard to do tray" just gets bigger. It's pathetic. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offshoremanxman Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 (edited) 56 minutes ago, John Wright said: But we know what the real issues are already. Passenger throughput/footfall is too small to derive a worthwhile income from non flying spend. They seem, perhaps subconsciously, to try to keep us holed up in departures for longer in the forlorn hope we might spend more. That’s the real issue. It’s around 600K passengers a year so unless the throughput and destinations increases significantly then the income isn’t scalable as there’s only so many cars that will be parked and coffees & food that will be sold and you can’t just keep putting up prices. We have a failed tourism strategy backing all this that's not going to increase travelers. I was talking about this the other day and if it was me I think they missed a massive trick with the KFC/Starbucks site in Douglas. If you stuck a drive through at the airport and re routed traffic through and alongside it you’d capture all the traffic in and out of the South of the IOM for fast food as there’s bugger all in C’town, PE & PSM and the Douglas site is in the stupidest place going. You could probably turn a nice turnover based lease on a few outlets. Other than that I think they’re largely stuffed thinking they can grow the income of a backwater airport in a destination that few people want to visit. Edited April 25, 2023 by offshoremanxman 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karellen Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 40 minutes ago, John Wright said: How do we pay for this? £5.00 airport use charge on every ticket. We already pay £13 APD tax per journey from the Isle of Man. Which is an air travel tax which benefits the Government pocket to the tune of £7M+ a year. It is disingenuous of the report to simply dismiss this air travel tax when discussing the island's sole outlet for air travel. 2 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wright Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 4 minutes ago, Karellen said: We already pay £13 APD tax per journey from the Isle of Man. Which is an air travel tax which benefits the Government pocket to the tune of £7M+ a year. It is disingenuous of the report to simply dismiss this air travel tax when discussing the island's sole outlet for air travel. Yes, and no. It’s a tax on air flights. Not a charge for airport use. But I agree that it should be part of the equation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Onchan Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 53 minutes ago, John Wright said: The problem is that the current structure doesn’t identify or resolve the issues. The new structure will have much more information gathering and processing to discover what the issues are. That involves extra staff. But we know what the real issues are already. Passenger throughput/footfall is too small to derive a worthwhile income from non flying spend. They seem, perhaps subconsciously, to try to keep us holed up in departures for longer in the forlorn hope we might spend more. The report actually identifies the basic need, to get passengers in/out of the Island efficiently and relatively pleasantly ( no airport is a pleasant experience for most “coach” or budget passengers. It doesn’t seek to address that. what makes IoM airport particularly unpleasant. 1. security. It’s essential we get one of the advanced scanners so there’s no more 100ml limit, plastic bags, remove and same for pda/phones/laptops. That should smooth flow. 2. Ensure planes land and take off on time. That’s sub divided. ATC. Recruit/train/retain sufficient numbers and have proper succession planning in place. Should never have come to this. If they have to then pay over the odds. End of runway light gantries. This needs reestablishing. Guidance systems. We have a renewed ILS. Install a GPS system ( I know there may be EU licensing issues and cost - but Jersey got there ). Reduce minima to 400, not 800 feet. These are quick fixes, but depend on airline operators installing the right equipment in their planes. Not sure that changing the CAT system level is economic or that most operators ( of small planes ) would invest. 3. Sort out the RinGo system. Get rid. Do something simple and successful that doesn’t have a non responsive off Island operator taking a cut. Outside of those three almost everything else is fiddling whilst Rome burns. There are other things. Improve the ambulift provision. A proper changing facility with hoists, adult size on both land side and airside. Adjust the seating in the downstairs departure holding lounge so the seats don’t slope forwards. They are horribly uncomfortable. How do we pay for this? £5.00 airport use charge on every ticket. And all of the above can be handled by the existing management, both at the airport and in the DOI Starship. Chris.... you've got it wrong, don't listen to those who think they know because they don't. Listen to those who use the airport on a regular basis. It really isn't rocket science. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Onchan Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 27 minutes ago, Banker said: I would be happy to pay more via airport/landing fee but I can imagine many people will just complain & demand subsidised fares to get off island No one is asking for subsidised fares now. All folk are asking for is the airport management to do their job and sort out the issues that can be solved relatively easily. The Report really is a recipe for disaster and unnecessary expenditure. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah 01 Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 1 hour ago, John Wright said: If they have to then pay over the odds. They've been paying controllers 'over the odds' here for decades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x-in-man Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 Desperate for money now apparently - they tried to resort to a fire damage insurance claim today I hear. 😄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daisy Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Andy Onchan said: And all of the above can be handled by the existing management, both at the airport and in the DOI Starship. Chris.... you've got it wrong, don't listen to those who think they know because they don't. Listen to those who use the airport on a regular basis. It really isn't rocket science. @Chris Thomas please do listen .... Edited April 25, 2023 by daisy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah 01 Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 1 hour ago, John Wright said: These are quick fixes, but depend on airline operators installing the right equipment in their planes. You are talking rhubarb, sir. The aircraft operating into IOM are all suitably equipped; it's the airport that isn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x-in-man Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 Just now, Utah 01 said: You are talking rhubarb, sir. The aircraft operating into IOM are all suitably equipped; it's the airport that isn't. No, he is quite right. The equipment he is talking about is pilots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah 01 Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 1 hour ago, offshoremanxman said: “If we imagine an Isle of Man suddenly without an airport today, it is obvious to see the inherent economic and social value it represents, although some of this will be intangible and impossible to quantify” No shit, Sherlock. How do we rid ourselves of these cretins? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah 01 Posted April 25, 2023 Share Posted April 25, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, x-in-man said: The equipment he is talking about is pilots. And you are talking double rhubarb. I'll bet a pound to a penny that all commercial crews who fly into IOM are trained to at least Cat2 and PBN. If they aren't then I withdraw my accusation. Edited April 25, 2023 by Utah 01 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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