Middle

[quilp]

2 hours ago, SleepyJoe said:

It is the lifetime of my offspring I'm more concerned with

I recently found myself in the company of my son and his mates, aged between 19 and 27. We were sitting around having a smoke, listening to music and talking about everything and nothing. I happened to ask if anyone was going to vote this election, the answer was provided in a mix of giggles and groans. All 7 of them never had the impulse to vote, they just weren't interested in local politics. Only a couple of lads admitted that their parents voted or discussed politics at home. Most of them felt they'd never vote. Virtually the same reactions were observed when I brought up the subject of climate-change and green matters. One lad mentioned the effect it was having on Polar Bears, and plastic in the oceans, another called it out as a conspiracy, to nods of agreement, but generally the conversation was short-lived though one lad suggested that it was all a pointless exercise unless the whole planet was on board at the same time and in agreement with the rules; that too much global industry had too much to lose against the global markets. That lad's probably near the mark...

I don't know how prevalent this naive and cynical outlook is amongst that age group but I got the feeling that all these lads felt a bit disenfranchised and disinterested in the Manx political arena, with little conviction to do become involved and do anything about it.

How do you win over people like them because I'd say they're more than minority? 

Edited September 14, 2021 by quilp

[SleepyJoe]

Politicians who care have to go and speak at schools, environmental bods too

They're communications professionals, they must go and do their job

The UNESCO Biosphere mob are a danger to society as they just big up the 'achievements' of the CM & his mates, who we all know had done close to feck all about preserving anything in the natural environment - the very opposite in fact by encouraging greenfield development

[The Phantom]

51 minutes ago, quilp said:

 that too much global industry had too much to lose against the global markets. That lad's probably near the mark...

 

Accurate.  Whilst environmental issues for the Island are in my mind fairly important.  The reality of it comes down to what shit (literally) we dump on our own land and in our own seas.  

Doesn't matter how many trees we plant, or renewable energy we try to adopt, we are small fry and little we do will have any great effect on the world's environment whilst the great economies of the world carry on regardless. 

[Stu Peters]

46 minutes ago, quilp said:

I recently found myself in the company of my son and his mates, aged between 19 and 27. We were sitting around having a smoke, listening to music and talking about everything and nothing. I happened to ask if anyone was going to vote this election, the answer was provided in a mix of giggles and groans. All 7 of them never had the impulse to vote, they just weren't interested in local politics. Only a couple of lads admitted that their parents voted or discussed politics at home. Most of them felt they'd never vote. Virtually the same reactions were observed when I brought up the subject of climate-change and green matters. One lad mentioned the effect it was having on Polar Bears, and plastic in the oceans, another called it out as a conspiracy, to nods of agreement, but generally the conversation was short-lived though one lad suggested that it was all a pointless exercise unless the whole planet was on board at the same time and in agreement with the rules; that too much global industry had too much to lose against the global markets. That lad's probably near the mark...

I don't know how prevalent this naive and cynical outlook is amongst that age group but I got the feeling that all these lads felt a bit disenfranchised and disinterested in the world around them, with little conviction to do anything about it.

How do you win over people like them because I'd say they're more than minority? 

Lots of people are saying 'we need to involve our young' and 'how can we stop our young people leaving the Island?' One of my fellow candidates at the Comis meeting last night talked about a trainee teacher who was being forced to go to the UK for a year of work experience, who 'might like it there and not come back'.

My view is that most young people won't be remotely interested in politics until they get a little older and start to be burdened by responsibility. You grow into certain things (like Manx Radio will never appeal to that demographic, but many  people will 'grow' into it).

Same with the youth drain. When I went to school very few of my class went to University...now (since Blair) it seems to be most kids. You're at an age where you WANT to spread your wings and get into the big wide world, and the fast pace of most large cities must be intoxicating. With often better job opportunities why would you want to come home? Maybe later, with children, you'll begin to realise that the Island DOES have a lot to offer, not least being close to your own family members.

Like climate change, I think it's natural and will sort itself out without knee jerk reactions.

[SleepyJoe]

Everything has an effect on the global environment and micro-states that happen to be islands are some of the worst affected

Luckily for us little in the way of extreme weather has arrived on our doorstep just yet

[quilp]

Are we the flutter of the Butterfly's wing then, Joe? 

[b4mbi]

@Keiran Hannifin@Stu Peters

I have a question...

"Wouldn't it be much easier and quicker to meet our net zero targets with a potential £8bn windfall?"

[Declan]

24 minutes ago, quilp said:

Are we the flutter of the Butterfly's wing then, Joe? 

Makes a change from IOMG usual policy of braking them on the wheel.

 

12 minutes ago, b4mbi said:

@Keiran Hannifin@Stu Peters

I have a question...

"Wouldn't it be much easier and quicker to meet our net zero targets with a potential £8bn windfall?"

Only from an actual windfall. The candidates in Rushen were very doubtful that anything like that would be achieved, when the world is moving away from gas rapidly. 

Though they thought it was Maughold and suggested a wind farm in that area. 

[quilp]

4 minutes ago, Declan said:

...the world is moving away from gas rapidly. 

Is it? The pipelines are expanding in Russia and China, supplying the network to surrounding countries, new deposits to be exploited off the coast of Israel, consumption appears to be on the rise in that part of the world. It'll be at least a generation or two before available gas has been exploited beyond economic recovery and necessary changes start to unfold with every nation on board. 

[b4mbi]

Just now, Declan said:

Only from an actual windfall. The candidates in Rushen were very doubtful that anything like that would be achieved, when the world is moving away from gas rapidly. 

Though they thought it was Maughold and suggested a wind farm in that area. 

Based on the candidates extensive experience in analysis of subsurface geological mapping within the oil & gas industry? 

The point is, much more information is needed before they can draw that conclusion. It's not even as though Gov't are being asked to spend £10m to find out definitely one way or the other. 

The world is not moving away from gas rapidly. It will still make up a third of the global energy mix in 2050. Nordstream2?

[Ramseyboi]

29 minutes ago, b4mbi said:

@Keiran Hannifin@Stu Peters

I have a question...

"Wouldn't it be much easier and quicker to meet our net zero targets with a potential £8bn windfall?"

Now I am no lover of government but I can’t help thinking that if there was a “potential £8bn windfall” just sitting there waiting to be utilised that we might have heard a bit more about it over recent years.

Other than Mr Cowins ramblings is their any actual data or analysis to back up the existence of £8bn just waiting to be withdrawn?

[quilp]

The topic of gas extraction has been discussed many times on here. Two threads spring to mind, both with widely varying figures, methods of extraction, environmental damage etc. And the benefits to the Manx economy. John Shimmin confirmed in 2013 that he was confident we'd be extracting gas resources "off the north of the Island" by 2020. Link to iomtoady also.

 

https://www.iomtoday.co.im/article.cfm?id=33073&headline=Gas+extraction+from+Manx+seas+could+be+good+for+the+Isle+of+Man's+bank+balance+-+but+will+it+do+environmental+damage%3F&sectionIs=news&searchyear=2017

 

 

Edited September 14, 2021 by quilp

[b4mbi]

I am satisfied gas is there, as this has already been proven but until it's surveyed and drilled you can only work with probabilities based existing knowledge about the quantity.

I can understand why it's problematic for the Government to actually invest tax payer funds to find out, so it would have to be a private development but the issue there is it costs £10's millions to survey and drill, and it's difficult to raise those funds privately if you don't have a supportive and committed Government to reassure investors.

[quilp]

After going through the figures estimated it's all very confusing. So many experts. Who/what to believe..? 

A subject better discussed on any of the existing threads. 

Edited September 14, 2021 by quilp

[The Phantom]

It's probably better if Govt only get involved to the most minimal extent required.  I can see of no way at all they could bring anything beneficial to the table. 

Let private industry raise funds and explore. If it's not viable then nothing will happen. 

If it is viable, then the Govt can just take any tax receipts that might be due. 

Plus it would probably be against their green credentials....... planting trees.