Covid Deniers and Anti Vaxxers

[HeliX]

4 minutes ago, ricardo said:

Joe Rogan is scrupulous about fairness and facts

Hahahahahaha

[Andy Onchan]

1 hour ago, ricardo said:

The 26 pages of Ian Kermode's letter seems too large for an attachment - I'm sure others will be able to oblige. The points Mr Kermode raises are also reflected by those in other links above though. He is far from alone.

For clarity, the 'high price' I refer to will be paid in professional, legal and financial standing, for any deemed culpable - by the courts - of causing harms. As applies to any of us.

Which courts?

[TheTeapot]

30 minutes ago, ricardo said:

Hi Teapot

 

We all know that coming to any issue with a closed mind is ‘dogma’ - I hope that is not where I am coming from. In common with most so-called ‘anti-vaxxers’ I am not ‘anti-vax’ - like them I have had most of the ‘normal’ ones. These have been around for a long time so are well tried and tested. Those of us that choose to take them do so from a place of awareness of the - low - risks. This is not the case with the hastily produced covid vaccines, which is largely why there is so much resistance to them.

 

In his hugely popular podcast, Joe Rogan is scrupulous about fairness and facts. In the link below he talks with comedian and political commentator Jimmy Dore (who has been 'double vaxxed’) about some of the issues - again it is hard to fault what they are saying:

 

 

 

My interest is not in debate - it is in encouraging any of those thinking of getting their children vaccinated to do a bit of research into possible negative outcomes.

 

 

Well thanks for your reply. Some points...

You didn't answer the question. I am not surprised. I'd really like to know what level of proof I would need to convince someone opposed to the current covid vaccines to change their mind.

Those 'normal' vaccines you describe, you didn't choose to take them, your parents did.

Joe Rogan is most definitely not 'scrupulous about fairness and facts'. He is an entertainer. He has also apparently caught covid, and taken a whole shitload of medication including the emergency use only on trial and very expensive monoclonal antibody treatment and hilariously ivermectin. Oh, and a bunch of additional steroids to add to all the rest. Problem is, he's got loads of impressionable lower intellect fans. 

On covid vaccination in children I don't see the point, the risk they are currently at would not be substantially lowered by vaccinating them, unlike adults. But I'm not opposing it cos of some fake doctor on youtube.

 

[display name]

1 minute ago, Andy Onchan said:

Which courts?

Wimbledon

[Roger Mexico]

44 minutes ago, HeliX said:

48 minutes ago, ricardo said:

Joe Rogan is scrupulous about fairness and facts

Hahahahahaha

That's unfair.  He's very, very careful not to allow a scrap of either of them anywhere near his listeners.

[Happier diner]

2 hours ago, ricardo said:

Apple rightly draws attention to the grave concerns expressed by the many doctors behind the Covid 19 ‘assembly’:

 

https://www.covid19assembly.org

 

Thousands of doctors and medical professionals Worldwide have also expressed similar concerns about the vaccine roll-out - many now refusing to administer the vaccine:

 

https://worlddoctorsalliance.com

 

https://gbdeclaration.org

 

Only the ignorant, or those with an agenda, would attempt to dismiss these valid concerns, or to ‘rubbish’ the qualifications of all of these medical professionals.

 

Also behind the Covid 19 Assembly are Francis Hoar, a highly respected UK barrister - who is also supported by many other legal professionals - and Toby Young, associate editor of The Spectator. These people have put their reputations 'on the line’ because they believe, with good reason, that something is not right.

 

Supreme Court judge Lord Sumption has also publicly expressed grave concerns about the unprecedented restrictions on our liberty:

 

https://collateralglobal.org/article/a-conversation-with-lord-sumption

 

On the Isle of Man, advocate Ian Kermode has asked valid and well-informed questions of our director of public health, reflecting the grave concerns listed in the links above. One of his questions asks:

 

“In such circumstances would the more prudent clinical advice be to err on the side of caution and not recommend Covid vaccines to those planning to have children?”

 

It is difficult to see how any reasonable person, let alone a medical professional, even more so a director of public health, could answer ‘no’ to such a question. Dismissing Mr Kermodes’ letter - which reflects the feelings and concerns of thousands of people on the island - as ‘nonsense’, as a previous contributor has, shows little understanding of the issues.

 

The government and health departments’ proposal to now vaccinate children with a vaccine that remains in its’ experimental stage is not only gravely concerning, but also deeply suspect.

 

The first obligation of doctors is “Do no harm”. All modern medicine carries some risk so it is the role of trials and testing to minimise that risk. Since none of the covid vaccines have completed their clinical trial phase no medical professional can say with a clear conscience that they will be doing no, or least, harm by administering them. Those that do so are potentially putting their patients at risk.

 

Some on this forum have expressed concerns about the approach Courtenay Heading has taken. Whilst it may be true that Mr Heading may not always present in the calmest or reasonable manner he is extremely well informed on the subject of vaccine harms. He enjoys considerable support from a wide range of island-based residents, including well-qualified professionals and established business people - not all of them ‘feeble minded’. This support will inevitably lead to legal action - not only in the 'fantasy common law court’. Those deemed culpable of not adhereing to their professional or political responsibilities are likely to pay a high price.

 

Over 90% of those who have died from issues relating to covid are elderly - 50% of these have been in institutional environments. Broadly speaking, children are not at risk from covid 19. Given all of the valid concerns around this vaccination program, would not the logical step be a moratorium of the vaccination of children until more data is gathered?

All of these are minority views by some way.

World Doctors Alliance. More like very very small collection of silly Doctors who have lost the plot and now claim there was no pandemic. Maybe they should change their name. They have absolutely no respect in the medical world. 

[ricardo]

'Roger', your comment is absurd. Joe Rogan's platform is 'long-form' conversation, which prompts wide-ranging discussion and attract World-class guests. Where facts are stated Joe is usually at pains to either confirm or provide a balanced view.

Should you doubt this, and be at all interested, below is Joe Rogan talking with Jordan Peterson and Brett Weinstein, both of whom he challenges multiple times. Whether one agrees with their perspectives or not they are both widely acknowledged as some of the clearest thinkers of our time. Amongst other things they are talking about tyranny - one of the things millions of people Worldwide are currently concerned about:-

 

Dr Tess Lawrie is featured in an Oracle film interview. To many she 'shines out' as a speaker of truth - particularly about the well-proven ivermectin. Ignore it if you choose:

https://www.oraclefilms.com/tesslawrie

 

[hampsterkahn]

Mr Heading says he is going to bring legal action against individuals who he claims have committed “ crimes against the people “

This will be  in a “Maritime court”

My  knowledge of legal matters is very limited and in In my naivety, I always thought “Maritime Courts “ were  to do with  the sea and shipping 

Is it on the same lines as the other year, in hired room at the Manchester Art Gallery, when  similar charges were brought by Mr H against IoM health minister and Director of public health and Jersey’s Public Health chief in a “common law court”

The charges were similar but the vaccine was  a different one, the  HPV vaccine.

The outcome was referred to in another story about “ Common Law Courts” in Iom News today( 15 Oct 2020) saying that the  “defendants” were all found   “guilty”.They were   required by the court “ to be removed from their positions and be barred from any future roles in health” -and  pay a shared fine  of £250,000 to Mr Heading and all HPV vaccs. were to cease   immediately.

Are there prosecutors/ defenders, judges, juries in these courts ?   who appoints them? who   gives judgement ?

  - or are they simply a soap box and refuge for the delusional

 

Edited September 2, 2021 by hampsterkahn

[Manx Bean]

7 hours ago, TheTeapot said:

No no, Martin Moore hates the government, VOR is in love with Ashford.

I was disappointed not to see Mr Moores name appear on an election ballot anywhere. 

He would have done had he not been abducted by aliens again apparently.

[John Wright]

44 minutes ago, ricardo said:

'Roger', your comment is absurd. Joe Rogan's platform is 'long-form' conversation, which prompts wide-ranging discussion and attract World-class guests. Where facts are stated Joe is usually at pains to either confirm or provide a balanced view.

Should you doubt this, and be at all interested, below is Joe Rogan talking with Jordan Peterson and Brett Weinstein, both of whom he challenges multiple times. Whether one agrees with their perspectives or not they are both widely acknowledged as some of the clearest thinkers of our time. Amongst other things they are talking about tyranny - one of the things millions of people Worldwide are currently concerned about:-

 

Dr Tess Lawrie is featured in an Oracle film interview. To many she 'shines out' as a speaker of truth - particularly about the well-proven ivermectin. Ignore it if you choose:

https://www.oraclefilms.com/tesslawrie

 

Joe Rogan. “ young healthy people don’t get Covid” “ I’m young and healthy, I’m not getting vaccinated”.

Same guy who announced today he was having to postpone this weeks podcast “ because he has Covid “

[Scipio]

9 minutes ago, John Wright said:

Joe Rogan. “ young healthy people don’t get Covid” “ I’m young and healthy, I’m not getting vaccinated”.

Same guy who announced today he was having to postpone this weeks podcast “ because he has Covid “

I know you are are a legal John, not a medic but even you should know that you can get Covid even with however many "vaccines" you might have.

[John Wright]

15 minutes ago, Scipio said:

I know you are are a legal John, not a medic but even you should know that you can get Covid even with however many "vaccines" you might have.

That’s not relevant though, is it?

The relevance is

Your chance of contracting Covid is substantially reduced if you’ve been vaccinated.

If you’ve been vaccinated and catch Covid there is a high probability it’ll be asymptomatic, or mild, and a very low chance, much reduced, of hospitalisation and death.

I may be a lawyer, but I’ve a science background, I did 20 years of medical negligence litigation, and I now adjudicate medical service complaints.

[Happier diner]

1 hour ago, ricardo said:

'Roger', your comment is absurd. Joe Rogan's platform is 'long-form' conversation, which prompts wide-ranging discussion and attract World-class guests. Where facts are stated Joe is usually at pains to either confirm or provide a balanced view.

Should you doubt this, and be at all interested, below is Joe Rogan talking with Jordan Peterson and Brett Weinstein, both of whom he challenges multiple times. Whether one agrees with their perspectives or not they are both widely acknowledged as some of the clearest thinkers of our time. Amongst other things they are talking about tyranny - one of the things millions of people Worldwide are currently concerned about:-

 

Dr Tess Lawrie is featured in an Oracle film interview. To many she 'shines out' as a speaker of truth - particularly about the well-proven ivermectin. Ignore it if you choose:

https://www.oraclefilms.com/tesslawrie

 

 

1 hour ago, hampsterkahn said:

Mr Heading says he is going to bring legal action against individuals who he claims have committed “ crimes against the people “

This will be  in a “Maritime court”

My  knowledge of legal matters is very limited and in In my naivety, I always thought “Maritime Courts “ were  to do with  the sea and shipping 

Is it on the same lines as the other year, in hired room at the Manchester Art Gallery, when  similar charges were brought by Mr H against IoM health minister and Director of public health and Jersey’s Public Health chief in a “common law court”

The charges were similar but the vaccine was  a different one, the  HPV vaccine.

The outcome was referred to in another story about “ Common Law Courts” in Iom News today( 15 Oct 2020) saying that the  “defendants” were all found   “guilty”.They were   required by the court “ to be removed from their positions and be barred from any future roles in health” -and  pay a shared fine  of £250,000 to Mr Heading and all HPV vaccs. were to cease   immediately.

Are there prosecutors/ defenders, judges, juries in these courts ?   who appoints them? who   gives judgement ?

  - or are they simply a soap box and refuge for the delusional

 

You don't seem to understand the concept of consensus.

Some doctors and medics are sceptical about vaccines. The vast vast vast majority are not.

I'm not a medic. But I recognise a consensus. I don't desperately seek out wayward opinion. Like I have quoted previously, there are 250,000 GPs in the UK. Every single one is recommending to their patients "get the vaccine". 

Ok. The odd crackpot Dr is saying don't. But that view is overwhelmingly outweighed.

[hampsterkahn]

3 hours ago, Happier diner said:

 

You don't seem to understand the concept of consensus.

Some doctors and medics are sceptical about vaccines. The vast vast vast majority are not.

I'm not a medic. But I recognise a consensus. I don't desperately seek out wayward opinion. Like I have quoted previously, there are 250,000 GPs in the UK. Every single one is recommending to their patients "get the vaccine". 

Ok. The odd crackpot Dr is saying don't. But that view is overwhelmingly outweighed.

I wasn’t saying anything about vaccination  or this particular one -in fact my view is very much pro vaccination - including this one.

Yes, very much the overwhelming  majority of GPs are in favour, and thank goodness they are. ( though you need to recheck your numbers - there aren't anything like   250,000 GPs in the UK-more in the region of 62,000)

It is the “maritime court “/“ common law court “ aspect which I don’t  understand  and was hoping it could be explained to me.

Edited September 2, 2021 by hampsterkahn

[HeliX]

I've watched a lot of Joe Rogan because he's amusing. But he's not in the least bit balanced. Factually nor mentally. He's a moron, and he'd be one of the first to agree that he was a moron.