P.K. Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 1 hour ago, Cambon said: Being against unfettered immigration does not make one racist. Is being Polish a different race? French? German? It has nothing to do with race. However, it has everything to do with someone from Poland working in the uk and claiming benefits for his whole family who live in Poland, and have never contributed to uk society. Much higher rates than are paid in Poland. When they got sick, they got free treatment on the NHS. UK pensions, everything, without even living here. Is that racism? No. Ethnicity has nothing to do with it. So stop calling it racism! @Cambon You need to stop reading the Daily Mail... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 18 minutes ago, HeliX said: Your national identity is based solely on whether your laws are set by an utter set of dickheads in Whitehall, or if some laws are occasionally co-ordinated by dickheads in Brussels? But at least they are our own dickheads elected by ourselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 5 minutes ago, The Voice of Reason said: But at least they are our own dickheads elected by ourselves. Or maybe by 30% of us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 1 hour ago, HeliX said: You can be racist against people who are the same ethnicity as you. For example, I despise the french. That's an idiotic concept. It isn't surprising though, because there is a lot of idiocy surrounding the meaning of racism. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 4 hours ago, woolley said: So it's racist now to question the wisdom of hundreds of thousands of immigrants per annum? Pressure on services and housing isn't an issue? I posted this some years ago. Here is what I remember of it as a reminder: According to the ONS our EU migrants contributed more £ per head to UK PLC than any other group. Hardly surprising really as they tend to be young, hardworking, no kids etc etc. In other words they had more right to use public services than any other demographic and that includes the indigenous population! Brexit was a massive FO to these people and having the whole of the EU to live and work in, an advantage we no longer have thanks to brexit, they decamped to seek their fortunes elsewhere. Now the UK needs migrant workers to function. There was a government scheme to try and get UK folks to do the hard, menial, agricultural jobs these migrants used to do but the scheme was abandoned due to the lack of interest shown. So the EU folks are now being replaced by non-EU workers. But unlike EU workers these people want to bring over the extended family, settle them all permanently in the UK etc etc. What a delicious irony and a massive own goal by the racist brexiteers. Welcome, one and all, to Reality Land... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 Just now, woolley said: That's an idiotic concept. It isn't surprising though, because there is a lot of idiocy surrounding the meaning of racism. I didn't make the definition, don't blame me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 1 hour ago, HeliX said: "Racism is prejudice or hostility towards a person's race, colour, language, nationality, or national or ethnic origin" So yes, it is. Elastic definition to suit an agenda, I would suggest. (Not your agenda.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 2 minutes ago, woolley said: Elastic definition to suit an agenda, I would suggest. (Not your agenda.) The agenda of... not being a dick to people based on their nationality? I suppose I'm struggling to see the sinister part here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 55 minutes ago, HeliX said: You can make up your own definitions if you want, but it won't change the accepted definition. Certainly looks like someone made up a "modern" definition to suit a "modern" agenda. Race and nationality are different. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 55 minutes ago, HeliX said: Your national identity is based solely on whether your laws are set by an utter set of dickheads in Whitehall, or if some laws are occasionally co-ordinated by dickheads in Brussels? Seems like a pretty flimsy national identity. Surely it should be based on patriotism or some other shite? Self-determination is the bulwark against the erosion of independence and national identity. Sure, you still have identity if you are governed from elsewhere, like Cornwall or Lancashire have identities. The idea of pooling sovereignty is as nonsensical as that of pooling virginity. You either have it or you don't. Some people think that for the sake of expediency it doesn't matter. It has mattered a great deal in the past and it will matter again in the future. You are stretching the scope of "occasionally co-ordinated" well beyond it's capabilities in relation to the interference in the governance of EU nations by Brussels, Helix, and I suspect that you know it. You must be aware of the supremacy of EU Law in the EU? Whether the current incumbents in Whitehall are an utter set of dickheads is neither here nor there because the remedy for that lies within UK borders rather than far away on the continent. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted December 13, 2023 Share Posted December 13, 2023 21 minutes ago, HeliX said: The agenda of... not being a dick to people based on their nationality? I suppose I'm struggling to see the sinister part here. Call it what it is - being a dick to other people. Unpleasant, but it isn't racism. Is an Irish joke racism? Is a Yorkshireman referring to a Lancastrian bastard racism? Of course not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted December 14, 2023 Share Posted December 14, 2023 59 minutes ago, woolley said: Self-determination is the bulwark against the erosion of independence and national identity. Sure, you still have identity if you are governed from elsewhere, like Cornwall or Lancashire have identities. The idea of pooling sovereignty is as nonsensical as that of pooling virginity. You either have it or you don't. Some people think that for the sake of expediency it doesn't matter. It has mattered a great deal in the past and it will matter again in the future. You are stretching the scope of "occasionally co-ordinated" well beyond it's capabilities in relation to the interference in the governance of EU nations by Brussels, Helix, and I suspect that you know it. You must be aware of the supremacy of EU Law in the EU? Whether the current incumbents in Whitehall are an utter set of dickheads is neither here nor there because the remedy for that lies within UK borders rather than far away on the continent. Love the idea that being a member of the EU is "pooling sovereignty" or some such nonsense. Same old same old. Unfortunately it's so much easier to grasp the concept behind a simple lying soundbite like "Take back control of our borders" that we never actually lost than understand the advantages of being a member of one of the best trading blocs on the planet. So the EU folks are being replaced by record numbers of non-EU migrants. Enjoy your foolhardiness. You deserve it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted December 14, 2023 Share Posted December 14, 2023 7 hours ago, woolley said: Call it what it is - being a dick to other people. Unpleasant, but it isn't racism. Is an Irish joke racism? Is a Yorkshireman referring to a Lancastrian bastard racism? Of course not. If you want the answer then look at the Equality Act 2010 and the protected characteristics set out in law. You will find that it includes race as well as nationality or national origin. So whilst you may argue that a caucasian British person is the same race as a caucasian Polish person then can still fall foul of the Equality Act for discrimination. Perhaps we need to be clearer and say that elements of the pro Brexit vote were racist and/or xenophobic. I have cited examples of both further back in the thread and I could easily find more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambon Posted December 14, 2023 Share Posted December 14, 2023 11 hours ago, HeliX said: You can make up your own definitions if you want, but it won't change the accepted definition. Woke definition! It is rubbish. Your made up definition basically means EVERYONE is a racist! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambon Posted December 14, 2023 Share Posted December 14, 2023 11 hours ago, P.K. said: @Cambon You need to stop reading the Daily Mail... I can’t. You bought the last copy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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