The Voice of Reason Posted November 29, 2023 Share Posted November 29, 2023 From PK’s favourite comic, the Guardian Rishi Sunak has rejected the suggestion that Brexit could be in peril after Ursula von der Leyen, the president of the European Commission, claimed that the UK could be on a path to rejoining the European Union. At an event in Brussels on Tuesday night, von der Leyen admitted that European leaders had “goofed up” over the departure of Britain from the bloc and suggested the younger generation could “fix” it. Asked if the UK could ever rejoin the EU, she replied: “I must say, I keep telling my children: ‘You have to fix it. We goofed it up, you have to fix it.’ So I think here too, the direction of travel – my personal opinion – is clear.” However, Sunak’s official spokesperson, replied that the British prime ministerdid not believe that Brexit was in peril. He told reporters at Westminster: “It’s through our Brexit freedoms that we are, right now, considering how to further strengthen our migration system. “It is through our Brexit freedoms we are ensuring patients in the UK can get access to medicines faster, that there is improved animal welfare. That is very much what we are focused on.” My words now Yes the EU did indeed “ goof up” by thinking that the UK had unwillingly subscribed to a EU superstate, Not one that would override the sovereignty of each of the member states. That chilling phase “ ever closer union” Rather than an economic alliance that would benefit all of the members. The UK was pushed too far and responded accordingly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 15 hours ago, The Voice of Reason said: However, Sunak’s official spokesperson, replied that the British prime minister did not believe that Brexit was in peril. He told reporters at Westminster: “It’s through our Brexit freedoms that we are, right now, considering how to further strengthen our migration system. “It is through our Brexit freedoms we are ensuring patients in the UK can get access to medicines faster, that there is improved animal welfare. That is very much what we are focused on.” How are these three things going in your opinion? I have put my own observations below each one. 1. Strengthening our migration system The migration system, post brexit and under Tory rule, has seen a massive increase in foreign workers and students and their families coming to the UK. "Illegal" immigration is also up (although tiny in numbers compared to the legal routes). 2. Ensuring patients in the UK can get access to medicines faster This sounds like a regurgitation of the lies told during the COVID-19 pandemic. Even if it is not then which medicines do patients now have faster access too? You can also only get medicines if you can get a GP or Hospital appointment and good luck with that after 13 years of Tory rule and austerity. 3. Improved animal welfare What?? Where exactly has animal welfare been improved? Where are there any proposals to improve animal welfare? The only reference to animals that I can recall this bunch making was the potential destruction and banning of XL bullies. I also think the "goofed up" is more in relation to how the relationship between the UK and EU went after Brexit rather than events leading up to it but that is not clear from the article nor your quotation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La Colombe Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, manxman1980 said: How are these three things going in your opinion? I have put my own observations below each one. 1. Strengthening our migration system The migration system, post brexit and under Tory rule, has seen a massive increase in foreign workers and students and their families coming to the UK. "Illegal" immigration is also up (although tiny in numbers compared to the legal routes). 2. Ensuring patients in the UK can get access to medicines faster This sounds like a regurgitation of the lies told during the COVID-19 pandemic. Even if it is not then which medicines do patients now have faster access too? You can also only get medicines if you can get a GP or Hospital appointment and good luck with that after 13 years of Tory rule and austerity. 3. Improved animal welfare What?? Where exactly has animal welfare been improved? Where are there any proposals to improve animal welfare? The only reference to animals that I can recall this bunch making was the potential destruction and banning of XL bullies. I also think the "goofed up" is more in relation to how the relationship between the UK and EU went after Brexit rather than events leading up to it but that is not clear from the article nor your quotation. Just to deal with point 3 at the moment as it’s a rather complex subject. But the attached, although a lengthy read does illustrate how Brexit can/has can improve(d)animal welfare in the UK. Much more than XL bullies https://www.mdpi.com/562294 This is a bit of a summary “Brexit provides the opportunity to reform UK farming to promote high animal welfare outside of the EU Common Agricultural Policy (CAP). Brexit means the UK can ban live animal exports and the import and sale of fur products and foie gras outside of the EU. Leaving the EU permits the UK to have stricter requirements for the Pet Travel Scheme (PETS) to control puppy smuggling. Brexit provides an opportunity for the UK Government to reform policy-making for sentient animals. New sentience legislation could establish a fully independent UK Animal Welfare Advisory body and mandate Government to use animal welfare impact assessments on all policy that affects sentient species.” No chance of any of that happening while the UK remained in the EU Edited November 30, 2023 by The Voice of Reason Last bit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 19 hours ago, The Voice of Reason said: Yes the EU did indeed “ goof up” by thinking that the UK had unwillingly subscribed to a EU superstate, Not one that would override the sovereignty of each of the member states. That chilling phase “ ever closer union” Rather than an economic alliance that would benefit all of the members. The UK was pushed too far and responded accordingly. Oh dear. Another one who thinks the EU is run by evil Goblins intent on world domination. That bloody goat really did let us all down... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 @The Voice of Reason there is one word in that link that is repeated over and over... OPPORTUNITY. Brexit was seven years ago. Which of these opportunities to improve animal welfare have been taken? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 7 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: @The Voice of Reason there is one word in that link that is repeated over and over... OPPORTUNITY. Brexit was seven years ago. Which of these opportunities to improve animal welfare have been taken? Quite. It's basically just a load of old flannel: “Brexit provides the opportunity to reform UK farming to promote high animal welfare outside of the EU Common Agricultural Policy (CAP). Brexit means the UK can ban live animal exports and the import and sale of fur products and foie gras outside of the EU. Leaving the EU permits the UK to have stricter requirements for the Pet Travel Scheme (PETS) to control puppy smuggling. Brexit provides an opportunity for the UK Government to reform policy-making for sentient animals. New sentience legislation could establish a fully independent UK Animal Welfare Advisory body and mandate Government to use animal welfare impact assessments on all policy that affects sentient species.” No chance of any of that happening while the UK remained in the EU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 34 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: @The Voice of Reason there is one word in that link that is repeated over and over... OPPORTUNITY. Brexit was seven years ago. Which of these opportunities to improve animal welfare have been taken? We’re all aware of the years of wrangling and the deal brokerage following the Brexit vote. Unfortunately it couldn’t all just untangle the day after the vote. You surely know that. But the fact is that the UK is now free to plough its own furrow in respect of animal welfare and just about everything else. At the end of the day it brings us back to what it is all about that being being a sovereign nation. I know you don’t like the term and would rather be subjugated within an un democratic alliance of a collective. But the majority took the opposite view 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 1 hour ago, La Colombe said: He's right. It won't happen. Fooled once. Never again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La Colombe Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 49 minutes ago, woolley said: Never again. Err, that's not what he said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 24 minutes ago, La Colombe said: Err, that's not what he said. I read the heading - Not while I'm on this planet. Is that not what he says? I don't have the time or inclination to listen to every bit of crap that people post up on a closed subject from 7 years ago. If it isn't what he says then, fair enough, he's not right after all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La Colombe Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 1 hour ago, La Colombe said: So what? A majority of Briton’s would support free beer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, manxman1980 said: How are these three things going in your opinion? I have put my own observations below each one. 1. Strengthening our migration system The migration system, post brexit and under Tory rule, has seen a massive increase in foreign workers and students and their families coming to the UK. "Illegal" immigration is also up (although tiny in numbers compared to the legal routes). 2. Ensuring patients in the UK can get access to medicines faster This sounds like a regurgitation of the lies told during the COVID-19 pandemic. Even if it is not then which medicines do patients now have faster access too? You can also only get medicines if you can get a GP or Hospital appointment and good luck with that after 13 years of Tory rule and austerity. 3. Improved animal welfare What?? Where exactly has animal welfare been improved? Where are there any proposals to improve animal welfare? The only reference to animals that I can recall this bunch making was the potential destruction and banning of XL bullies. I also think the "goofed up" is more in relation to how the relationship between the UK and EU went after Brexit rather than events leading up to it but that is not clear from the article nor your quotation. Right, back to 1. Strengthening our migration system By which I think you are talking immigration into the UK. Yes I think the UK should offer shelter and succour to those who need it. Those who are being persecuted in their own countries, for example. As regards migration into the UK to take up jobs which need to be filled. All for it, but why should one group ( EU citizens) have priority over the rest of the world. If someone is best for the job be they from Madrid or Adelaide they shouldn’t have an inbuilt advantage. Not good for those disadvantaged and not good for the UK Edited November 30, 2023 by The Voice of Reason Change to last para for clarity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted November 30, 2023 Share Posted November 30, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, P.K. said: Oh dear. Another one who thinks the EU is run by evil Goblins intent on world domination. That bloody goat really did let us all down... Bloody goat it might have been. But I wouldn’t have wanted to see it ( or a donkey) pushed to its death from a bell tower. Nor a bull being speared to death at the Bowl, Douglas in the name of entertainment. Being the sort of thing that happens in some of neighbouring European cousins, Edited November 30, 2023 by The Voice of Reason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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