Douglas Sh@hole!

[Ghost Ship]

As I recall, weren't the pubs shut all day on sundays in the winter?  

I don't remember Sunday luchtime drinking to be a "thing" in the Isle of Man in the 1970s and I was surprised at its popularity in the UK when I went to university.

(I know I was really pissed off when I came home each Christmas that the pubs weren't open on Sunday evenings... )

[Gladys]

Just now, Ghost Ship said:

As I recall, weren't the pubs shut all day on sundays in the winter?  

I don't remember Sunday luchtime drinking to be a "thing" in the Isle of Man in the 1970s and I was surprised at its popularity in the UK when I went to university.

(I know I was really pissed off when I came home each Christmas that the pubs weren't open on Sunday evenings... )

I can't remember which is why I asked.  I was also amazed to find pubs open in England on Xmas day!  Still can't quite get my head around that. 

[John Wright]

24 minutes ago, Gladys said:

So not lunchtime, but in the evenings? 

Neither. No Sunday drinking in Winter except for bona fide travellers. When it was allowed in summer it was 12-2 and 8-10. That became Sunday hours in winter when winter Sunday opening was allowed.

Its why places like the Liverpool Arms, Richmond Hotel, Half Way House and Rest & Be Thankful were established where they were. The distance constituted bona fide travelling.

For restaurants the test was serving a substantial meal. That was defined as 5/- or 25p for 20+ years until 1983, when I think it went up to £1

[Ghost Ship]

1 minute ago, Gladys said:

I can't remember which is why I asked.  I was also amazed to find pubs open in England on Xmas day!  Still can't quite get my head around that. 

I know!  The parents of one of my closest friends at university ran a pub.  I couldn't believe it when he told me they opened at lunchtime Christmas Day.   (And I still haven't gone to a pub on Christmas Day over 40 years later... )

[Gladys]

Just now, John Wright said:

Neither. No Sunday drinking in Winter except for bona fide travellers. When it was allowed in summer it was 12-2 and 8-10. That became Sunday hours in winter when winter Sunday opening was allowed.

Its why places like the Liverpool Arms, Richmond Hotel, Half Way House and Rest & Be Thankful were established where they were. The distance constituted bona fide travelling.

For restaurants the test was serving a substantial meal. That was defined as 5/- or 25p for 20+ years until 1983, when I think it went up to £1

Thanks John, that makes sense.  I never was a Sunday lunchtime drinker, but there was something in the back of my mind.  But yes, I remember when it changed.  Also, we had all day opening for the rest of the week during the summer when the UK did not, I think. 

[Ghost Ship]

4 minutes ago, John Wright said:

Neither. No Sunday drinking in Winter except for bona fide travellers. When it was allowed in summer it was 12-2 and 8-10. That became Sunday hours in winter when winter Sunday opening was allowed...

Yeah - that's what I remember in winter.

I also had a summer job in a bar on the prom.  I remember turning up at about 7:30 on Sunday evenings and finding a queue (of what sounded like Glaswegians) about quarter of a mile long waiting for the doors to open at 8 ...

[Ghost Ship]

7 minutes ago, Gladys said:

Thanks John, that makes sense.  I never was a Sunday lunchtime drinker, but there was something in the back of my mind.  But yes, I remember when it changed.  Also, we had all day opening for the rest of the week during the summer when the UK did not, I think. 

I'm pretty certain the IoM had summer all day opening from when I started visting pubs in the mid-70s  (And I remember visiting the Bowling Green at lunch in between A level exams in the morning and afternoon!).

UK only introduced all day opening in the mid-80s.

Edited June 22, 2022 by Ghost Ship

[John Wright]

Just now, Gladys said:

Thanks John, that makes sense.  I never was a Sunday lunchtime drinker, but there was something in the back of my mind.  But yes, I remember when it changed.  Also, we had all day opening for the rest of the week during the summer when the UK did not, I think. 

Yes.

We had annual licensing renewals in 1983.

All the Chinese restaurants were doing 50p businessmen special lunches. I had to prep 30 restaurant owners, most with poor English, to tell the court that average meal cost over the day was £1+. Customers ate soup, main and desert. Of course they were suspicious. I suspect they were largely cash take and under declaring for VAT and tax.

I did the Catering College training restaurant  renewal as well. Stan, the head of department was impossible. The cost of a meal was £0.40 or £0.50. Not £1.00. I’d suggested he should estimate the actual value if he had to pay rent, staff, heat, light and power and VAT and make a profit. I’m the office we had it all worked out. More than £1. In court he refused to “guess on oath”! Henry Callow, chairing the Bench ate there twice a week. He just said, after watching my efforts for 10 minutes “ Mr X, I eat there. I know the value of the meal more than qualifies as £1 and substantial. Licence granted”

[John Wright]

6 minutes ago, Ghost Ship said:

I'm pretty certain the IoM had summer all day opening from when I started visting pubs in the mid-70s  (And I remember visiting the Bowling Green at lunch in between A level exams in the morning and afternoon!).

UK only introduced all day opening in the mid-80s.

My recollection is 

Summer was 10-10 Mon to Thursday. 10-11 Fri & Sat and 12-2 and 8-10 Sunday.

Winter was 12-10 Monday to Saturday. Closed Sunday.

It also explains the popularity of private members clubs. They got an extra hour in the evening to 11pm and winter Sunday lunches.

There were a good dozen in Douglas.

[The Voice of Reason]

16 minutes ago, John Wright said:

My recollection is 

Summer was 10-10 Mon to Thursday. 10-11 Fri & Sat and 12-2 and 8-10 Sunday.

Winter was 12-10 Monday to Saturday. Closed Sunday.

It also explains the popularity of private members clubs. They got an extra hour in the evening to 11pm and winter Sunday lunches.

There were a good dozen in Douglas.

My recollection on Sundays was 12 - 1.30 pm. About 90% certain I am right. Not that it really matters.

[finlo]

16 minutes ago, The Voice of Reason said:

My recollection on Sundays was 12 - 1.30 pm. About 90% certain I am right. Not that it really matters.

You are correct, then it was 2 then 3 before it became all day.

[AOR]

36 minutes ago, John Wright said:

My recollection is 

Summer was 10-10 Mon to Thursday. 10-11 Fri & Sat and 12-2 and 8-10 Sunday.

Winter was 12-10 Monday to Saturday. Closed Sunday.

 

My recollection too.

Yep, Friday and Saturday 11pm.

I daresay my grandparents got a good nights kip over the weekend back in them days.

[AOR]

57 minutes ago, John Wright said:

I did the Catering College training restaurant  renewal as well. Stan, the head of department was impossible. The cost of a meal was £0.40 or £0.50. Not £1.00. I’d suggested he should estimate the actual value if he had to pay rent, staff, heat, light and power and VAT and make a profit. I’m the office we had it all worked out. More than £1. In court he refused to “guess on oath”! Henry Callow, chairing the Bench ate there twice a week. He just said, after watching my efforts for 10 minutes “ Mr X, I eat there. I know the value of the meal more than qualifies as £1 and substantial. Licence granted”

I'm surprised. Stan had run pubs all his life in UK prior to taking the job at the college.

[Ghost Ship]

16 minutes ago, Roxanne said:

We all did. Even the street lights went out early. I have to say I have some support for your argument about the all night drunks wobbling home. When the 24 hours drinking thinhs came in on the basis that it would make the job of the police much easier not having everyone turfed out at the same time, there were many who wondered if it might end badly. I think it has. Our young people’s culture is far too much centred on alcohol. They’re already dealing with all kinds of mental health issues and then we tell them it’s ok to go out drinking all night and sleeping all day. I’m not sure I like it either, for society as a whole. 

I used to live on the prom. I was frequently woken up. I suggest earplugs that drummers use. It’s an easier solution than trying to change society at this stage. 

I also have a lot of sympathy for AOR's point of view.

Certainly when "24 hr" drinking was introduced in the UK I don't think it had the effects desired by the man who introduced it.  (A man who obviously knew nothing about the drinking habits of the British - who have been notorious as the pissheads of europe for centuries). 

Whether the same is true of the IoM or not I don't know, but in my experience the IoM is even less restrained when it comes to drinking than the rest of the UK.  Except possibly Scotland.

Also I'm not sure really heavy drinking is as much of an issue among young people in the UK as it used to be - it seems to me to be confined more to people who grew up in the 70s, 80s and possibly 90s.

Where we live is on a popular route out of our city centre from the local nightclub district to a couple of large estates.  It used to be quite common to be woken up by young drunks and students staggering home.  It just doesn't happen any more.

I'm not sure wanting to keep young people on (or to attract them to) the IoM is a great argument for poor drunken behaviour.  Maybe too many other people enjoy it themsleves to complain about it.

 

[Stu Peters]

10 hours ago, The Bastard said:

Personal arguments between you two aside, do you think your "window licking" comment was OK, Stu ?

Have to say it just seemed horribly dated and horribly insensitive for someone who's supposed to represent (all of) the people.

Yes, it was OK because it was a joke (we still have those, right?). A play on the KFC strapline. Who was it insensitive to, the people prepared to sit in their cars in a ridiculously long queue? Throwaway comment, unworthy of another witch trial. I'm with Ricky Gervais on having a laugh. I don't go out to offend people (except the usual suspects on here and Facebook) but some would take offence (often by proxy) at absolutely anything I say, so zero given.