IOM DHSC & MANX CARE

[Gladys]

2 minutes ago, Dirty Buggane said:

Still waiting.

No, he dealt with that in the PAC, apparently.  How "point by point" it was, or even if it was a rebuttal of anything at all, I am not sure. 

[Dirty Buggane]

I doubt there was any rebutel, just it was not my fault. Only doing as They told me, as I have to its the rules.

[Kopek]

The fact that the English govt are also launching a 'Covid' review, with much greater publicity, can only help us get to some of the answers that may have been avoided, in fact, some of their findings may illuminate some of our actions.

[Dirty Buggane]

Professor teflon, his fault. I think your expectations are sadly wanting.

[Kopek]

.....but Ashton is out of the top tier, will they hang him out to dry to protect theirselves????

It may not give a truthful answer but it would allow the 'Govt' to distance theirselves???

[Mercenary]

On 6/2/2023 at 8:45 PM, Shake me up Judy said:

Great work by Paul Moulton again, and a reminder that people died because the Island's Chief Medical Director was over-ruled and bullied by a U.K. civil servant with no medical training or expertise. Backed by the DHSC, the Minister and senior Manx politicians. It still manages to shock even now...

It's not quite that simple though.

The headline of today's Telegraph alludes to this.

 

Of course all relevant considerations should have been made (including listening to the clinical director), but that doesn't necessarily mean the approach was the wrong one or completely unjustified.

[Banker]

1 hour ago, Mercenary said:

It's not quite that simple though.

The headline of today's Telegraph alludes to this.

 

Of course all relevant considerations should have been made (including listening to the clinical director), but that doesn't necessarily mean the approach was the wrong one or completely unjustified.

Correct & in particular the decision to refuse to allow residents to return home & apply for a weekly lottery to be allowed home was scandalous!

[John Wright]

3 minutes ago, Banker said:

Correct & in particular the decision to refuse to allow residents to return home & apply for a weekly lottery to be allowed home was scandalous!

And was only for a short time in the light of a once in a 100 years event. An event not comparable to Spanish flu 100 years before due to modern transport.

I still think we locked down too late ( Ranson was correct ) but that we didn’t ameliorate the consequences by arranging adequate quarantine and isolation immediately ( not sure who messed that up ).

We really had it good here from May 2020, by comparison to most places. 

[Boo Gay'n]

Although not used formally in the UK, the Hippocratic Oath starts with "first, do no harm" and is widely accepted as underpinning the ethics of medical practice.

You can see immediately why any physician would struggle with politicians when they can see that a proposed course of action will inevitably cause harm - perhaps to thousands.

That Hetty Ewart was prepared to toe the line set by the politicians and not the physicians and Rosalind Ranson was not shows clearly what type of characters they each have.

[piebaps]

With hindsight John you're probably right. Ranson however (from the Tribunal evidence) was advocating border controls around 13th March onwards. The first known case was a returning resident who flew in from Spain via Liverpool on 15th March. I flew in from LGW the same day and was a bit twitchy for two weeks afterwards. Border controls started on 27th.

While Ranson's treatment was disgraceful, I'm not convinced that anythikng could reasonably have been in place by 15th even if her advice had been heeded. Even then, we still had the Steam Packet "blind spot" although we didn't know it at the time!

[The Phantom]

2 hours ago, John Wright said:

And was only for a short time in the light of a once in a 100 years event. An event not comparable to Spanish flu 100 years before due to modern transport.

I still think we locked down too late ( Ranson was correct ) but that we didn’t ameliorate the consequences by arranging adequate quarantine and isolation immediately ( not sure who messed that up ).

We really had it good here from May 2020, by comparison to most places. 

My family and I were part of one of the first groups to be locked down and isolated when we got back from holiday two or three days before the borders closed and about a week before the whole Island got locked down.  That was a suprise and  sucked massively.  At least most people had a chance to prepare themselves for the shit storm to come.  

[John Wright]

28 minutes ago, The Phantom said:

My family and I were part of one of the first groups to be locked down and isolated when we got back from holiday two or three days before the borders closed and about a week before the whole Island got locked down.  That was a suprise and  sucked massively.  At least most people had a chance to prepare themselves for the shit storm to come.  

My partner, Paul, arrived back 24 hours before lockdown, having escaped Bansko 24 hours before it was locked down with an armed police cordon sanitaire, he drove to Igoumenitsa and got to Italy by ferry, then was refused boarding on the Civitavecchia Barcelona ferry ( he’d checked in and was in queue ), so drove to Spain and stayed a week whilst I sorted ferry tickets from Santander wigh pet kennels or pet friendly cabin. Brittany Ferries then cancelled and he did a mad dash to eurotunnel and up through England to Heysham.

[The Phantom]

6 minutes ago, John Wright said:

My partner, Paul, arrived back 24 hours before lockdown, having escaped Bansko 24 hours before it was locked down with an armed police cordon sanitaire, he drove to Igoumenitsa and got to Italy by ferry, then was refused boarding on the Civitavecchia Barcelona ferry ( he’d checked in and was in queue ), so drove to Spain and stayed a week whilst I sorted ferry tickets from Santander wigh pet kennels or pet friendly cabin. Brittany Ferries then cancelled and he did a mad dash to eurotunnel and up through England to Heysham.

Now that sounds like a trauma.  At least you could meet him from the ferry and I'm assuming had supplies at home. 

We had to get someone to drive a car to the airport, leave the keys in it for us and do some shopping for us before we arrived back.  I think I still have a 10kg bag of Pasta somewhere that someone helpfully bought for us! 

I was in South Africa, which was quite delayed in the Covid infections and where there was absolutely nothing Covid related happening at all, apart from rumours of one infected person here or there.  Watching the reports from Europe and then landing straight into something from 28 Day Later was weird. 

[Banker]

13 minutes ago, John Wright said:

My partner, Paul, arrived back 24 hours before lockdown, having escaped Bansko 24 hours before it was locked down with an armed police cordon sanitaire, he drove to Igoumenitsa and got to Italy by ferry, then was refused boarding on the Civitavecchia Barcelona ferry ( he’d checked in and was in queue ), so drove to Spain and stayed a week whilst I sorted ferry tickets from Santander wigh pet kennels or pet friendly cabin. Brittany Ferries then cancelled and he did a mad dash to eurotunnel and up through England to Heysham.

But if they’d locked down earlier as some demanded & Paul was stuck in UK for several weeks or longer with no accommodation etc what would your view be then?

[John Wright]

15 minutes ago, Banker said:

But if they’d locked down earlier as some demanded & Paul was stuck in UK for several weeks or longer with no accommodation etc what would your view be then?

He’d have stayed in Spain, or Bulgaria. We are lucky. However, if you read my earlier post, I say I support earlier border lock down but with early introduction of quarantine or isolation on return.

Assuming they’d given 48 hours notice he could have driven back from Bulgaria, just. 

The three times we’ve not been able to travel, Italy - Spain, Bulgaria - Italy, GB - Spain, we were mid journey, in the queue for the ferry, or checked in. Frustrating.

If you close your borders you have a duty to let your residents return. Spain and Italy were allowing their nationals/residents in.