asitis Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 8 minutes ago, cissolt said: From Paul Moulton's comment it sounds like we may actually see some accountability. I suppose the women who has already left will be the scapegoat Hopefully a few will be sweating ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowman Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 I wonder if she might be reinstated? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 12 hours ago, Gladys said: Isn’t the judiciary independent of the AG's office, so why would an external judge need to be brought in because the AG's office presented one side of the case? I can see it if it needs someone with particular technical skills, eg an understanding of documentary forensics, although you would think weighing the veracity of evidence is part of the job anyway. I can't see it as necessary on the grounds of impartiality. The way it was presented by PM sounded more like a judicial review, with the AG arguing the strength of their client's evidence rather than an investigation as such. I could be wrong, but we only have PM's tweets to go by. Sorry Gladys, I forgot to answer this before. While the judiciary is nominally independent, there are bound to be connections in such a small place and it would certainly look chummy to an outsider. In any case it's not automatically the job of the judiciary to investigate this sort of thing (which is why I said it might be a QC or similar) it's just they they tend to called in as obvious impartial outsiders. In our case there's the additional practical problem that any Deemster called in to assess the evidence would then be unable to hear any subsequent criminal case(s) or any appeals afterwards. And one of the usual acting Deemsters might not be seen as impartial as they would be reliant on the government for future work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Mexico Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 13 minutes ago, Bandits said: That’s how it usually works. By the time someone is found to blame someone else parachuted out a year before because they knew they’d be the one to blame. More difficult to get away with in these circumstances if people are found to have misled the tribunal or behaved in a criminal or incorrect manner. Saying "The bad lady made me do it!" may not convince coming from highly paid professionals. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 14 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said: Sorry Gladys, I forgot to answer this before. While the judiciary is nominally independent, there are bound to be connections in such a small place and it would certainly look chummy to an outsider. In any case it's not automatically the job of the judiciary to investigate this sort of thing (which is why I said it might be a QC or similar) it's just they they tend to called in as obvious impartial outsiders. In our case there's the additional practical problem that any Deemster called in to assess the evidence would then be unable to hear any subsequent criminal case(s) or any appeals afterwards. And one of the usual acting Deemsters might not be seen as impartial as they would be reliant on the government for future work. No need to apologise, Roger. All will be clearer when the Tribunal judgement is published. From what has been published so far, damage limitation should not be interpreted as preserving individuals, but the reputation of the IOM in general and the health service, whether DHSC or Manx Care, in particular. That area has taken quite a few knocks recently. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Grumpy Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 1 hour ago, snowman said: I wonder if she might be reinstated? Why not? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buncha wankas Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 1 hour ago, snowman said: I wonder if she might be reinstated? She should be reinstated as the CEO of DHSC, her integrity and expertise would be beneficial to our NHS. The current CEO was complicit in bullying Dr Ranson out of her role. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 4 minutes ago, buncha wankas said: She should be reinstated as the CEO of DHSC, her integrity and expertise would be beneficial to our NHS. The current CEO was complicit in bullying Dr Ranson out of her role. Is that right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nellie Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 (edited) I wonder if this mess is in any way connected to why Mark Lewin was suddenly given a permanent made-up job in the Cabinet Office. Remember that Will Greenhow was in charge of the overall IOM CoVid response, so perhaps he is going to take the rap for this? Edited May 10, 2022 by Nellie 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2112 Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 13 minutes ago, Nellie said: I wonder if this mess is in any way connected to why Mark Lewin was suddenly given a permanent made-up job in the Cabinet Office. Remember that Will Greenhow was in charge of the overall IOM CoVid response, so perhaps he is going to take the rap for this? Good theory but even if it were true, accountability, honesty and integrity are in very short supply especially here. Also things have a habit of being swept under the carpet. I don’t think anyone will take the rap, or even take one for the team. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2112 Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 1 hour ago, buncha wankas said: She should be reinstated as the CEO of DHSC, her integrity and expertise would be beneficial to our NHS. The current CEO was complicit in bullying Dr Ranson out of her role. I would imagine that she wouldn’t want to get involved with IOMG ever again. I would reckon a very large settlement. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarndyce Posted May 10, 2022 Share Posted May 10, 2022 1 hour ago, buncha wankas said: The current CEO was complicit in bullying Dr Ranson out of her role. Do we know that this is correct? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted May 11, 2022 Share Posted May 11, 2022 38 minutes ago, Jarndyce said: Do we know that this is correct? No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joebean Posted May 11, 2022 Share Posted May 11, 2022 (edited) I await the published report with interest. If the finding of the Tribunal is that the Dr was treated unfairly and bullied out of her role for whistle-blowing the implications of this for the way our Government works and acts are serious. “Government” is not an entity in itself but is made up by the actions of individuals who are placed in positions of authority and trust and receive, in most cases, salaries commensurate with that responsibility. If they are found to be unworthy of that responsibility, authority, trust and reward they should be removed. The Chief Minister should act in these circumstances to make the changes necessary. Simply sweeping the issues aside and claiming that the actions were historic or made in special circumstances will only erode his reputation and credibility. There are big decisions to be made here involving senior people. Courage, principle and integrity is required. Let’s see what the published report and following actions bring forward. Edited May 11, 2022 by joebean 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlebushy Posted May 11, 2022 Share Posted May 11, 2022 10 hours ago, asitis said: Hopefully a few will be sweating ! Not if they are anything like Prince Andrew! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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