finlo Posted January 14, 2022 Share Posted January 14, 2022 17 minutes ago, Andy Onchan said: what the feck have they done with all the profit they have made over the years? 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 15 hours ago, Andy Onchan said: Correct, ethics are a rarity in business, which is exactly why they should fund their own business with their own money. I don't think many would really give a flying fig how they fund it, but fund it they should without State aid. I wouldn't be surprised if MUA give them some credit, IOMG is soft like that. COMIN, if they haven't already, should be preparing to step in to operate/supply/guarantee supplies to their share/stakeholders (the Great Manx Taxpayer). As has been pointed out by me and others on here.... what the feck have they done with all the profit they have made over the years? I see what you are saying. But lets just think about it. If we stopped giving them gas on credit, they would go out of business. Let's say they owe us a million or so anyway. That would be lost for ever. Thats our money. Then what? We get the MUA to employ all the staff and take over the service? That's possible. However what happens about the deficit between the cost of gas and the charge for it. The MUA would then be selling at a loss (just as it probably is doing with electricity at the moment) Where does that money come from? Do you have a suggestion? Easy to criticise and we all feel it's a poor do. We don't have gas at home either and I am expected to sub it through my taxes. That angers me too. I think why don't the gas users pay? It's called a dilemma. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 minute ago, offshoremanxman said: They’ve been paid out. It’s standard private equity practice to take everything out through the top as it’s all debt funded at the end of the day. There’s never anything left in the business. No different to the old SPC owners - they all invest on a time cycle and the trick is that by the time you flip your asset to another private equity company at the end of your investment cycle the buyer will be picking up the tab for investments you never made in order to maximize all the dividends the Top Co paid out. That’s why we’re now spending £50M on new SPC ferries - the investment was deferred by the old owner as it meant they could maximize their upstreaming of cash instead. That's right. They are in it for the money, nothing else. There is no shame in that. Its business. It's what we signed up to. Any profits will be long gone from the business here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Onchan Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 6 minutes ago, Happier diner said: That's right. They are in it for the money, nothing else. There is no shame in that. Its business. It's what we signed up to. Any profits will be long gone from the business here. And that's why we should look to end this ridiculous arrangement. It's simply not sustainable. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 7 minutes ago, Andy Onchan said: And that's why we should look to end this ridiculous arrangement. It's simply not sustainable. I totally agree. It will need skill and planning though. We need to protect our interests. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Johnson Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 Lets imagine Manx Gas was owned by an old Manx family/ firm. It had been in their hands since the beginning of time. Would we be expecting them to charge less for the gas they are selling us than they were paying for it for a couple of years? It is not sustainable for more than a few weeks. Manx gas have been making 10% profit for years on an agreement with our government. I dont actually think 10% is a lot of margin for a company with sales very limited by our small size. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyJoe Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Happier diner said: I totally agree. It will need skill and planning though. We need to protect our interests. What interests? Natural gas as a home heating system has no future Our interests lie in ensuring Tynwald commits to investing in the development of renewable energy production for affordable home heating ASAP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Non-Believer Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 I'd like to see the gas extractors and refiner's reasons for gas prices being at their current levels. This is the real reason for consumers at the end of the chain paying the prices that they are. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 10 minutes ago, SleepyJoe said: What interests? Natural gas as a home heating system has no future Our interests lie in ensuring Tynwald commits to investing in the development of renewable energy production for affordable home heating ASAP This is true. That's a long term view and it's right. But what about the 20,000 folks who have has boilers. NOW and bills to pay NOW. I agree though, It would have helped massively if we had a couple of wind turbines and some solar NOW as well. No sign of anything happening on that front. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the stinking enigma Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 How much of this is related to the US deciding European policy because they don't want anyone using the Nord Stream 2? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 39 minutes ago, Non-Believer said: I'd like to see the gas extractors and refiner's reasons for gas prices being at their current levels. This is the real reason for consumers at the end of the chain paying the prices that they are. Good luck with that. It's the Russians. Holding us all to Ransome. And we (Europe) has no other option. If only we had some gas of our own....oh hang on a minute😅 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyJoe Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Happier diner said: This is true. That's a long term view and it's right. But what about the 20,000 folks who have has boilers. NOW and bills to pay NOW. I agree though, It would have helped massively if we had a couple of wind turbines and some solar NOW as well. No sign of anything happening on that front. Is it the MUA who buy the gas? There should be a question in Tynwald as to what the future holds for citizens who depend on gas heating to keep them warm in winter Either that, or whoever does the buying should be hauled before a Tynwald committee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbnuts Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 (edited) 23 minutes ago, SleepyJoe said: Is it the MUA who buy the gas? There should be a question in Tynwald as to what the future holds for citizens who depend on gas heating to keep them warm in winter Either that, or whoever does the buying should be hauled before a Tynwald committee As should the people who insisted new refurb public sector housing over recent years all had to have Gas heating . Oh wait , it was government who had a vested interest in more than one way. Edited January 15, 2022 by Numbnuts 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Johnson Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Numbnuts said: As should the people who insisted new refurb public sector housing over recent years all had to have Gas heating . Oh wait , it was government who had a vested interest in more than one way. Not sure that is true, PS housing when refurbed had gas heating put in but I think you will find that is because it meant no oil tanks and associated costs/ space and big bills to fill a tank at once. New private houses all have gas too, its a cheapness thing from a construction point of view, no conspiracy. Oil tanks and oil boilers are a LOT more expensive than gas boilers and a free to the house supply of pipes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SleepyJoe Posted January 15, 2022 Share Posted January 15, 2022 Will new buildings standards specify heat pumps rather than gas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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