Manx Gas MEGA Price Rise

[SleepyJoe]

11 hours ago, Non-Believer said:

Is it just me that thinks it strange that Manx Gas would sponsor a function that essentially uses a "rival" Utility's product?

Does IOMG sell gas to Manx Gas to carry it to Pully who then sell it back to them?

[Non-Believer]

1 hour ago, pongo said:

Wage increases are part of the problem unless tied to increased productivity. Wage increases drive inflation in a vicious circle.

Periodic wage increases as an expectation is very much a problem of the public sector today. Seldom an expectation in the private sector where demand for skills drives wages.

We are coming out of a period of spectacularly low oil and gas prices.

This only part of the picture though, wage demands and settlements are driven by inflation too. The difference is that Public Sector workers have organised negotiating bodies to help keep their wages in line with that inflation, the chances are that most private sector workers are seeing a consistent drop in their standard of living due to wage rises that are not on a par with inflation.

Whilst such settlements increase inflation through increased taxes and charges to cover them, Govt is stoking inflation in other ways. Consider the 400 increase in Govt headcount during the last administration at (say) £25k pa each. That's a minimum addition of £10M that the taxpayer has to find through Govt wage costs.

[pongo]

1 hour ago, SleepyJoe said:

Does IOMG sell gas to Manx Gas to carry it to Pully who then sell it back to them?

do they?

[pongo]

 

46 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

Consider the 400 increase in Govt headcount during the last administration at (say) £25k pa each. That's a minimum addition of £10M that the taxpayer has to find through Govt wage costs.

Increased taxation is anti-inflationary driver. It reduces the money supply. Taxation one of the basic controls which governments have re money supply and therefore inflation. On the IOM, increasing taxation is (more or less) the only instrument which govt can use to reduce the money supply and therefore inflation.

 

55 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

This only part of the picture though, wage demands and settlements are driven by inflation too.

As I said, a vicious circle. Increasing the money supply drives inflation.

 

 

38 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

Public Sector workers have organised negotiating bodies to help keep their wages in line with that inflation

That's  certainly a big part of the problem - the unreasonable expectation of an annual pay increase not linked to improved productivity drives wage inflation. There are other structural problems typical of public sectors too. For example pay grades - where people get paid the same according to their grade but irrespective of how well they perform. And, for example, pay grade inflation - where people effectively move up those grades over time, often for no good reason.

 

42 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

the chances are that most private sector workers are seeing a consistent drop in their standard of living due to wage rises that are not on a par with inflation

Inflation which is partly fuelled by public sector wage expectations. In the private sector people are paid in proportion to the demand for their skills. That seems mostly fair. Obviously there should be space for adjustment where a small number of people are not able to compete.

[Non-Believer]

6 minutes ago, pongo said:

 

Increased taxation is anti-inflationary driver. It reduces the money supply. Taxation one of the basic controls which governments have re money supply and therefore inflation. On the IOM, increasing taxation is (more or less) the only instrument which govt can use to reduce the money supply and therefore inflation.

 

As I said, a vicious circle. Increasing the money supply drives inflation.

 

 

That's  certainly a big part of the problem - the unreasonable expectation of an annual pay increase not linked to improved productivity drives wage inflation. There are other structural problems typical of public sectors too. For example pay grades - where people get paid the same according to their grade but irrespective of how well they perform. And, for example, pay grade inflation - where people effectively move up those grades over time, often for no good reason.

 

Inflation which is partly fuelled by public sector wage expectations. In the private sector people are paid in proportion to the demand for their skills. That seems mostly fair. Obviously there should be space for adjustment where a small number of people are not able to compete.

So what is your answer to all these problems? It would appear to be to expect to see both public and private sector employees have their wages decrease in value due to inflation? To what point and end?

Where would employed people be now if this had been adopted say, 25 years ago and their pay had not kept pace with the inflation over that period?

Pay demands are largely reactionary to inflation and cost of living figures and even Public Sector settlements often do not match those figures. Those inflation figures are being driven both by Govt policies (or failure thereof) and market forces of commodities within our capitalist system, which a small "some" invariably do extremely well out of.

This is equally invariably overlooked; it's more expedient to blame the workforces, private and public for just trying to keep pace.

[Ringy Rose]

41 minutes ago, pongo said:

In the private sector people are paid in proportion to the demand for their skills. That seems mostly fair.

I'm not sure that's the case a lot of the time. My experience of the private sector isn't that different to the public sector, in both cases seniority being rewarded not skills. The worst nepotism I've ever seen has been in the private sector.

Oddly enough "wage inflation" isn't ever seen as a problem when the execs are awarding themselves bumper pay rises, paid for through corporate inflation, most of which ends up squirreled away in hidden trust funds. Funny how execs always "add value" through mere inflation.

Proles, know your place.

[Banker]

26 minutes ago, Ringy Rose said:

I'm not sure that's the case a lot of the time. My experience of the private sector isn't that different to the public sector, in both cases seniority being rewarded not skills. The worst nepotism I've ever seen has been in the private sector.

Oddly enough "wage inflation" isn't ever seen as a problem when the execs are awarding themselves bumper pay rises, paid for through corporate inflation, most of which ends up squirreled away in hidden trust funds. Funny how execs always "add value" through mere inflation.

Proles, know your place.

Most managers in private sector have their remuneration linked to performance, public sector managers get pay rises despite performance 

[Ringy Rose]

8 hours ago, Banker said:

Most managers in private sector have their remuneration linked to performance

Ah, but of course. It's all performance related and definitely absolutely not at all to do with how close mates you are with the big boss. 

As I said above, the worst nepotism I've ever seen has been in the private sector. Very well paid managers who only got the job because they're the boss' kid/nephew/daughter's bit of fluff, but make Nick Black look like an organisational genius. YMMV, as always.

Edited November 18, 2021 by Ringy Rose

[Banker]

Looks like electricity also up a minimum of 5% , Rob Callister to blame 😂

https://gef.im/2021/11/27/electricity-price-increase-highly-likely/

[Driver2020]

Help to pay for all the new Land Rover discoverys and Mitsubishi vehicles they have purchased lately.

[Non-Believer]

17 minutes ago, Driver2020 said:

Help to pay for all the new Land Rover discoverys and Mitsubishi vehicles they have purchased lately.

Indeed, the MUA hierarchy have long had an expensive taste in motorised transport, still 4wd of Discovery standard is essential for all those cross-country, winter night emergency call outs that they're obliged to attend....

Perhaps their procurement is part of the, "Significant Financial Challenge" referred to by Rob Callister in the article?

Edited November 27, 2021 by Non-Believer
extra bit

[cissolt]

1 hour ago, Banker said:

Looks like electricity also up a minimum of 5% , Rob Callister to blame 😂

https://gef.im/2021/11/27/electricity-price-increase-highly-likely/

If you listen to the interview Rob states that renewable technologies are still 10-15 years away from being efficient.  He's obviously not looked out over douglas bay! Obviously he is not the right man to be leading a green energy push.

[finlo]

1 hour ago, Banker said:

Looks like electricity also up a minimum of 5% , Rob Callister to blame 😂

https://gef.im/2021/11/27/electricity-price-increase-highly-likely/

30% will be nearer the mark.

[cissolt]

Did anyone read this article on gef?

https://gef.im/2021/12/02/manx-gas-latest/

 

Why are Manx utilities holding 700k a year for Manx gas customers? 

 

Mr Callister said Manx Utilities was holding about £700,000 per year on behalf of Manx Gas customers and was waiting for the agreement to be reached ‘to ensure that 100% of those refunds is given back to Manx Gas customers.

I thought the cost to Manx gas was profit neutral?!

As part of a proposed voluntary agreement between gov and Manx Gas, Treasury offered to reduce loan charges to Manx Utilities, in respect of the natural gas network extension, and it in turn would be able to reduce its charges to Manx Gas, to pave the way for rebates.

 

[Amadeus]