Declan Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 I'm not convinced by this scheme. It feels like one of those pet-projects one MHK pushes for that end up costing the Island millions. The economic case hasn't even been made yet. Surely we need to understand that before we even consider alternatives or exploring for it. How many millions of taxpayer pounds is this going cost? How much will our utility bills rise to find this dream? 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bandits Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 12 minutes ago, Max Power said: "Fierce opposition" from a minority of half wits.... https://www.manxradio.com/news/isle-of-man-news/crogga-licence-decision-met-with-fierce-opposition/ Fierce opposition from the least fierce people you will find anywhere. Rob Mercer who is about as fierce as a glove puppet and Andrew Langan-Newton a failed candidate for MHK. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Power Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 16 minutes ago, Declan said: I'm not convinced by this scheme. It feels like one of those pet-projects one MHK pushes for that end up costing the Island millions. The economic case hasn't even been made yet. Surely we need to understand that before we even consider alternatives or exploring for it. How many millions of taxpayer pounds is this going cost? How much will our utility bills rise to find this dream? That is a good point Declan, we don't have a good track record in dealing with, well anyone with a brain. I could see the island giving huge grants to Crogga to finance their exploration, when we should be charging them. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2112 Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 If Mercer had the courage of his convictions, and really felt strongly he could always stand down from being an MLC. Can’t see that happening though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Phantom Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 51 minutes ago, Declan said: How many millions of taxpayer pounds is this going cost? How much will our utility bills rise to find this dream? None, nothing, zero (in theory). All privately funded by Crogga (at the moment) which has no Govt funding. The Govt owns the seabed and Crogga is just asking for permission if they can continue prospecting. No requests for funding or infrastructure have been made. I am sure Crogga probably wants to keep it this way. As far as I can see, the only way this will cost 'us' anything is if the Govt starts meddling and insists on involvement above its remit. 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b4mbi Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 37 minutes ago, Declan said: I'm not convinced by this scheme. It feels like one of those pet-projects one MHK pushes for that end up costing the Island millions. The economic case hasn't even been made yet. Surely we need to understand that before we even consider alternatives or exploring for it. How many millions of taxpayer pounds is this going cost? How much will our utility bills rise to find this dream? How many times? NO TAXPAYER MONEY IS INVOLVED. it's a free hit for the Government in terms of a hydrocarbon tax/royalty they charge on extraction, and then they'd receive VAT on the processed (cleaned) gas when it is exported. Hydrocarbon tax would be outside the FERSA agreement. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 1 minute ago, b4mbi said: NO TAXPAYER MONEY IS INVOLVED. Experience skepticism where the government are concerned is warranted. Especially since the cheerleaders for this project seem to be ideologically driven. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
b4mbi Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 10 minutes ago, Declan said: Experience skepticism where the government are concerned is warranted. Especially since the cheerleaders for this project seem to be ideologically driven. I hear you, but why would you not cheerlead a potential £8 BILLION into Government coffers for no Government outlay? Let's see. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
0bserver Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 We have a moral obligation to the GMP to find our what is under the sea once and for all. Then this topic can either be put to bed for good, or we have a debate about the benefits of extracting the gas. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoTailT Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 28 minutes ago, 0bserver said: We have a moral obligation to the GMP to find our what is under the sea once and for all. Then this topic can either be put to bed for good, or we have a debate about the benefits of extracting the gas. Here here. Let's see what's there. Then decide how we can benefit as an Island from private initiative. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banker Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 53 minutes ago, Declan said: Experience skepticism where the government are concerned is warranted. Especially since the cheerleaders for this project seem to be ideologically driven. But government aren’t involved other than giving a license. Do UK government finance BP or shell to explore in UK waters? No they don’t!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 On 5/3/2022 at 2:54 PM, HeliX said: In monetary terms, perhaps... Has anyone been given a report on what (if any) ecological and environmental effects will result from the exploration, or the extraction? Stu has demonstrated on plenty of occasions the ecological and environmental effects are not something that he is concerned about. Even in his reply to you it is clear how flippant he is about such subjects when he refers to appeasing "a couple of fishermen and eel grass enthusiasts". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Onchan Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 On 5/3/2022 at 2:34 PM, HeliX said: No, nobody does, that's the point. It could be 0. Even if it's non-0, we're a long time away from the require infrastructure to extract and process. My understanding is that spudding to full field development can be done in as little as 4.5 years providing all the finance, resources and equipment is in place and available for use when required (but that's not always possible). The oil and gas majors will sit on wells for a number of years before going into full field development due to ongoing commitments and world stocks. I'm not sure if Crogga have any other commitments or not. The point is that if there is gas down there in sufficient quantity then 'we' will have at least some energy security and can develop it as and when required, which is a lot more than many other countries can boast. If there isn't anything down there then it won't have cost the GMT anything. Zilch. We will need a mix of energy sources in the future, including gas. To think otherwise at this stage is folly. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Phantom Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 42 minutes ago, manxman1980 said: Stu has demonstrated on plenty of occasions the ecological and environmental effects are not something that he is concerned about. Even in his reply to you it is clear how flippant he is about such subjects when he refers to appeasing "a couple of fishermen and eel grass enthusiasts". To be honest, I can totally understand Stu's comments and I'd like to think of myself as fairly green and having a active interest in the marine environment. It is pretty ridiculous that they are only allowed to prospect in the winter (which will obviously be hampered considerably by weather). So Crogga will probably have to sit twiddling it's thumbs until next winter before it can continue and probably only get a few days in due to the weather; when in reality if they were allowed to prospect this summer, I'd suspect we would find out the the answer to the big gas question a lot sooner. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted May 5, 2022 Share Posted May 5, 2022 1 hour ago, b4mbi said: I hear you, but why would you not cheerlead a potential £8 BILLION into Government coffers for no Government outlay? Let's see. If even half that amount ends up in Government coffers as a result of this without any taxpayer spend I'll eat a gas pipe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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