Isle of Man Budget 2022-23

[Happier diner]

22 minutes ago, 0bserver said:

Which will do nothing but help inflation to surge on the Isle of Man. 

There needs to be a separate negotiation for workers earning less than (say) £30,000. Giving a 4% rise to someone earning £100k is obscene. 

Last year it was a flat £500 + 1%

[Numbnuts]

1 hour ago, Happier diner said:

Last year it was a flat £500 + 1%

Wasn't the £500 paid as a intrim payment till negotiations had finished ? 

[Happier diner]

11 minutes ago, Numbnuts said:

Wasn't the £500 paid as a intrim payment till negotiations had finished ? 

No

[Happier diner]

1 minute ago, offshoremanxman said:

As usual we’ll end up paying for all this while we will probably see next to nothing being added to our own pay by way of increases.

All what? Nothing has happened. It's just conjecture. 

[Boris Johnson]

8 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

All what? Nothing has happened. It's just conjecture. 

Alf could show intent and that he has grown a pair by stating that PS/ CS salaries will be held at current rates for the next 2 or 3 years until the Covid spending has fully shown as to what state we are in financially.

For any CS/ PS reading this thinking you are hard done by, you are not, lots of the private sector went without for a lot of the last couple of years and plenty of businesses have taken on debt to keep them going.

Just remember you got paid through all of the Covid pandemic, a lot of us did not.

 

[Banker]

Problem with public sector pay rises is that lots get an extra pay rise as they move to next spine point in scale as reward for doing their job so lots end up with very large rises including those on very high salaries!

[Ham_N_Eggs]

21 minutes ago, Boris Johnson said:

Alf could show intent and that he has grown a pair by stating that PS/ CS salaries will be held at current rates for the next 2 or 3 years until the Covid spending has fully shown as to what state we are in financially.

For any CS/ PS reading this thinking you are hard done by, you are not, lots of the private sector went without for a lot of the last couple of years and plenty of businesses have taken on debt to keep them going.

Just remember you got paid through all of the Covid pandemic, a lot of us did not.

 

The reason the civil service manage to negotiate any payrise is because of the unions. If more private sector workers utilised unions then they wouldn't get messed around by employers so much.

 

[Non-Believer]

1 hour ago, Happier diner said:

No

Yes. The £500 was an interim payment pending the resolution of 2.75% which has not long been agreed.

 

[Ham_N_Eggs]

18 minutes ago, Banker said:

Problem with public sector pay rises is that lots get an extra pay rise as they move to next spine point in scale as reward for doing their job so lots end up with very large rises including those on very high salaries!

Indeed. Payrises should be tiered. More to those at the bottom and less to those at the top. So a 1% rise is 1.5% and 0.5% to those at the top (or something like that).

As for moving up spine points, new government workers only get three spine points. Which, whilst not ideal, is still better than previously. Most of those employed before this scheme came in will now have reached the top of the spine for their grade and will just receive the annual payrise.

[Boris Johnson]

21 minutes ago, Ham_N_Eggs said:

The reason the civil service manage to negotiate any payrise is because of the unions. If more private sector workers utilised unions then they wouldn't get messed around by employers so much.

 

That may be the case for the civil service but in the real world, even if all private sector employees joined a union and asked for the same, that would not make year on year "inflation plus" increases in pay affordable or even in the best interests of the wider economy. It would end in hyper inflation. Remember the 70s and the UK pay rises driven by the big unions?

Pay rises in the main should be based on increases in productivity. With inflation taken into account, it should not the main thing to be considered.

Edited February 14, 2022 by Boris Johnson

[Ham_N_Eggs]

31 minutes ago, Boris Johnson said:

That may be the case for the civil service but in the real world, even if all private sector employees joined a union and asked for the same, that would not make year on year "inflation plus" increases in pay affordable or even in the best interests of the wider economy. It would end in hyper inflation. Remember the 70s and the UK pay rises driven by the big unions?

Pay rises in the main should be based on increases in productivity. With inflation taken into account, it should not the main thing to be considered.

The civil service does not get inflation plus. 

Why were the unions having to ask for more cash for workers? Do you remember the oil crisis which caused the biggest increase in inflation. Yes increased wages did have an impact but to not raise wages would have meant starvation. 

how do you "increase productivity" of you are working flat out. Such a Tory view. Poor people just need to work harder to make money for me and I'll just them a few crumbs.

[HeliX]

1 hour ago, Boris Johnson said:

That may be the case for the civil service but in the real world, even if all private sector employees joined a union and asked for the same, that would not make year on year "inflation plus" increases in pay affordable or even in the best interests of the wider economy. It would end in hyper inflation. Remember the 70s and the UK pay rises driven by the big unions?

Pay rises in the main should be based on increases in productivity. With inflation taken into account, it should not the main thing to be considered.

If pay were linked to productivity a lot of people would be getting significant more than inflation payrises:

 

Productivity has outstripped wages for decades now. Those at the top of corporations, and the shareholders, are siphoning it all off. Increasing prices, not increasing wages, pocketing the extra value for themselves. Something needs to address that - and then you can have significant payrises for the workers.

[Banker]

1 hour ago, Ham_N_Eggs said:

Indeed. Payrises should be tiered. More to those at the bottom and less to those at the top. So a 1% rise is 1.5% and 0.5% to those at the top (or something like that).

As for moving up spine points, new government workers only get three spine points. Which, whilst not ideal, is still better than previously. Most of those employed before this scheme came in will now have reached the top of the spine for their grade and will just receive the annual payrise.

Yes but for those on top of spine for grade many just get the job regraded so they then start getting the spine increases again!

[The Old Git]

4 hours ago, Happier diner said:

Last year it was a flat £500 + 1%

I need new glasses. Thought they’d been given a small Italian car. 

[Banker]

54 minutes ago, offshoremanxman said:

The equivalent Channel Islands budget debate is quite interesting. Not surprised to see retired civil servants pushing for a higher VAT (GST) rate on the spenders than a higher tax rate being applied to their solid gold final salary pension payments.

https://gsy.bailiwickexpress.com/gsy/news/retired-civil-servants-concerned-about-narrow-tax-review-consultation/

Yes and they are also looking at cutting department budgets if taxes don’t go up then services will be cut, I think there’s also a public sector pay freeze 

https://guernseypress.com/news/2022/02/14/what-would-you-cut-pr-asks-committees/