VikingRaider Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 So the Challengers, Leopards and Abrams are soon to be on their way. Anyone care to bet when the Ruskies will announce the first one has been destroyed ? Obviously this will be well before they actually enter into service in Ukraine 😁 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 £5er says 30% of them get destroyed within 3 months. Without adequate support and maintenance they will break down and be sitting ducks for aircraft. People grossly underestimate what it takes to keep advanced tanks rolling. The Abram's has a flipping jet engine ffs! British Army hasn't lost a Challenger to an enemy yet, but hiring it out without maintenance and adequate support will be different. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 2 minutes ago, Albert Tatlock said: £5er says 30% of them get destroyed within 3 months. Without adequate support and maintenance they will break down and be sitting ducks for aircraft. People grossly underestimate what it takes to keep advanced tanks rolling. The Abram's has a flipping jet engine ffs! British Army hasn't lost a Challenger to an enemy yet, but hiring it out without maintenance and adequate support will be different. It's obvious there are non-Ukrainians fighting the Russians and providing technical backup. Who do you think is running the Ukrainian forces? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Tatlock Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 3 minutes ago, GD4ELI said: It's obvious there are non-Ukrainians fighting the Russians and providing technical backup. Who do you think is running the Ukrainian forces? Providing information and weapons is very different to putting boots on the ground. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 I would speculate that friendly boots have been on the ground shortly after the invasion began. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 1 minute ago, quilp said: I would speculate that friendly boots have been on the ground shortly after the invasion began. One of the worst kept secrets . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTeapot Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 Not very good for the environment tanks, big emissions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 14 minutes ago, Albert Tatlock said: Providing information and weapons is very different to putting boots on the ground. Information? The US & UK are running the show for the Ukrainians, there's far more happening than gets reported. The US troops hate the Russians, especially the officers who were in Afghanistan aiding the Taliban. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 1 minute ago, TheTeapot said: Not very good for the environment tanks, big emissions. But the German tanks are amazingly fuel-efficient, over 250 miles on a full tank over rough terrain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTeapot Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 4 minutes ago, GD4ELI said: But the German tanks are amazingly fuel-efficient, over 250 miles on a full tank over rough terrain. It carries a literal ton of fuel. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 1 minute ago, TheTeapot said: It carries a literal ton of fuel. One tonne of fuel = +/- 1,000 litres, so 4 litres / mile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quilp Posted January 25, 2023 Share Posted January 25, 2023 The tech installed in the Leopard, Challenger, Abrams, will require familiarisation for the Ukrainians. Think it would be safe to say that training and readiness for each machine will have been taking place for months. If any tanks are destroyed in combat it'll just as likely be because of unfamiliar operation as anything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 18 hours ago, Albert Tatlock said: £5er says 30% of them get destroyed within 3 months. Without adequate support and maintenance they will break down and be sitting ducks for aircraft. People grossly underestimate what it takes to keep advanced tanks rolling. The Abram's has a flipping jet engine ffs! British Army hasn't lost a Challenger to an enemy yet, but hiring it out without maintenance and adequate support will be different. The NATO members just wouldn't supply MBT's without the maintenance train to support them. Simple as... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 17 hours ago, quilp said: The tech installed in the Leopard, Challenger, Abrams, will require familiarisation for the Ukrainians. Think it would be safe to say that training and readiness for each machine will have been taking place for months. If any tanks are destroyed in combat it'll just as likely be because of unfamiliar operation as anything else. The tactics don't vary much from tank to tank though. If 100 MBT's are supplied, which seems likely, then that's enough to create two armour-heavy battlegroups. Bearing in mind the Ukrainians re-took Kherson without them they should be able to take advantage of the Russian weak points which are: Chracteristically weak and slow Command and Control Very poor and vulnerable Logistics LMF - the vast majority of the planks don't want to be there... I'll bet the Ukrainians are already registering targets and creating Fire Plans.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted January 26, 2023 Share Posted January 26, 2023 (edited) 3 minutes ago, P.K. said: The tactics don't vary much from tank to tank though. If 100 MBT's are supplied, which seems likely, then that's enough to create two armour-heavy battlegroups. Bearing in mind the Ukrainians re-took Kherson without them they should be able to take advantage of the Russian weak points which are: Chracteristically weak and slow Command and Control Very poor and vulnerable Logistics LMF - the vast majority of the planks don't want to be there... I'll bet the Ukrainians are already registering targets and creating Fire Plans.... You realise they have all the US & UK military satellites helping then? These things have the very best optics, think Google Maps and then increase the resolution. A new update every 10 minutes or better. As you say, many Russian troops don't want to be there, their officers don't know how to train a modern army. Edited January 26, 2023 by GD4ELI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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